A Little Neighborly Advice?

Hi K.,

I am a survivor -- breast cancer stage 3 -- my advice is to not say anything to the kids. Yes, they are plenty old enough to help out, but you really don't know if they are helping in other ways. Your helping with the housework enables them to spend time with their Mom. My daughters would read to me, rub my back, empty my surgical drains, etc. They may have very little time left with their Mom (let's pray that's not the case) and they are overwhelmed. A new home and a critically ill Mom. Please continue to show them what good neighbors do for each other. Enlist some help from other neighbors or your church. Maybe a cleaning and cooking schedule. If they lose her , they'll be cleaning and cooking soon enough! Bless you for helping her!

L.

Gee K., I disagree with everyone. Although, the other postings were very nice. I would say go over and do what you can when you can. Keep out of their business, if you say or do anything it will cause you problems. It will not be worth the few words of encouragement that you say to those teenagers. If you want to continue to be a friend to your neighbor do what you can and go home. Teach your own little ones what you expect from them. Your neighbors children are doing what they are able and what they have been taught to do. You are not going to change them in one walk and talk, and I doubt if she would want you to try. I am speaking from experience. GL K.

As a person who has been on the children's side of this type of story, here are my thoughts. My mother was diagnosed with stage iv lung cancer when I was 23. She was divorced and living alone at that time. There was quite a bit of time when my sister (21) moved in to help her and I also stayed with her when possible (I was living out of state at the time). I stayed with her for up to a month at a time.

It is great you are visiting and helping out when possible. They are probably quite thankful, especially for your friendship and time. I would talk with the mom about whether or not you should enlist the kids help. Yes, they are "old enough" to help out, but they apparently haven't been asked to in the past and right now they are going through something EXTREMELY difficult.

At times like these, people need to be the priority - not cleaning, dishes, laundry, etc. Of course, those things have to be done when they can...but the whole family should really be concentrating on spending quality time with their mother. The laundry will still be there tomorrow. Their mom may not. Long term survival rates for lung cancer discovered this late in the game are VERY poor.

As a neighbor that has known the family for less than a year, I would approach this subject cautiously. The children may take your suggestion the wrong way and close off. Honestly, it could affect the way they even interact with their mother..feeling like they are not doing what they "should be". They may simply shut down...and this is not the time for that. They need to be "present". Be a listening ear for them, take over meals, personally help when you can, but don't lecture. Let them know that NOW is the time to spend with their mom. They should be taking advantage of every minute they can.

Two years after my mom passed away, my father-in-law died of a brain tumor. His wife, who normally kept a spotless house, slacked on some of the cleaning. She felt guilty about this, but the family soon adopted the saying, "If it doesn't breathe, it doesn't matter." Take care of the people (and pets) during times like these. The rest will still be there when it is all over.

PS I personally think the father should be doing some of those things...but, again, this is not the time or the place to lecture him about his "responsibilities" either.

You are awesome to be so caring and giving! I have to say sorry and disagree with Kathy on the last post. If you are friends with this person, there is NO reason you cannot get the family on board to help her out. Even pulling her husband aside, tellling him that maybe you can help set up a chore chart for the kids as a "pick me up" for his wife and you are willing to help him out. Set it up like it is a surprise, not so much pointing out their housekeeping flaws. Not to mention her immune system is low with the drugs and she needs to be in a sterile and clean living place. Maybe even point that out by saying "hey, you know I had a friend and they said that the house really needs to be super clean so they stay healthy while on chemo, how about I get a chart together, we surprise your mom and all pitch in together so she can get better"....?

They are all probably in a state of shock, watching someone being vibrant go downhill and may not even realize the mess is there. They are all probably scared. It takes sometimes someone from the outside to help out and step in. If that doesn't work, then maybe coordinate with other neighbors and do shifts of say everyone takes a day to stop by for 35 minutes to help them start a load of laundry, take out the trash, do dishes.
If you are not close to this person, then stick with the neighbor plan.

I babysit some older boys, I hear from their mom how over run she feels working hard and coming home to a messy house. These boys are 9 and 12 and fully capable of helping. I had a "lecture" so to speak on how hard their parents work to give them what they need and they are old enough to start helping. SO I have driven them to their house, set a timer and asked them to see who can clean up best to surprise their mom! Once they saw how happy it made their mom after a long day of work, it continues!!!!!!! SO I disagree it will cause problems, it is how it is handled not a matter of if it is handled, know what I mean?

This woman is lucky to have a caring and compassionate neighbor like you! I agree with Kathy here, you can't change this situation with one talk, this is a deeply ingrained pattern and if she can't get her kids to help now it might just be awkward for you! If you do have the time to help her just do what you can when you are there( but ask her first!)
That said, you could ask her husband and kids to help you do a garage sale or some type of fund raiser to hire someone to come in to clean! Maybe that would clue them in a little bit! Good luck!

Wow! Having been through a rough time with our family recently, thank you, on their behalf! You must be such a blessing to all of them. I would invite the kids to help out as you work. If their mom has been doing it all, maybe the kids just don't feel comfortable or able. Often, kids will do better for someone other than their parents, too. I wouldn't lecture, just invite them to work along and talk to them about their school, how they feel with what their mom is going through, what do they thing Mom or Dad would really like during this time, what would help them, etc. After you've built a relationship with them, you can start by saying something like next week you won't be able to come over for as long, and if they could do all the laundry, you'd be willing to fold and iron, or ask if they'd rather fold and iron. Then you're not telling them to do it, but asking if they can help you. It'll take a long time, but it sounds like you have some time before their mom is going to be up to doing it all again. I'd just be as supportive and positive as you can. I think they'd be very receptive to that. Maybe not at first, but after they see that you really do care about them and their family and what they're going through. I hope it works out!

K., Dearest,
You are a Sweetheart!!!

It is amazing already. that you help her so much, practically taking her into your closest circle of kindred... Now,...
I would see the right thing to do is
to arrange for her kids a "secret meeting"!
They are at the age when they still love/believe (in)fairy tales. Now, teach them to do "magic".
Their mom is sick and does not have much energy. She light be also very depressed at times. They are the ones who ara always around and beloved by mom who cared about them for all this time, which is all their life. Now, it is their turn, to ADD to the sweet words of "Mom, I love you", also a proof in action. Now, they need to make every their move in the house remembering that the DEDICATE it to mom: it is not washing dishes, it is SHOWing mom, HOW they love her. It is not vacuuming, it s CLEANING the world for Her, TO MAE HER HAPPY... and so on. If you help them shift their mind from "oh, this boring cleaning, those awful dishes" to "I am in charge, and I am the one who can make mom's life happy and filled with beauty" - yeah, stress that THEY ARE IN CHARGE : teenagers LOVE being in charge,, and make decisions, and be important and needed - stress on i, think psychologically, how to involve them so that they are happy, making mom happy - the house filled with smiles and hugs and CARING love for real, not just in words = like YOU do (but do not fring yourself in as an example, because you do it as you feel it right - you do it from your huge heart. These kids do not know yet how to express their love in deeds that seem mundane, but you know what, they need to learn that there is no BIG HEROIC EVENTS unless the little small heroic loving events create one huge WOW of recognition of their HUGE LOVING HEARTS!
I said. This is my advice.
Pick it up from here, and all of you, become CREATIVE in BUILDING a beautiful world around The Mom!
P.S.
Sad strike: with cancxer, we never know how long or short her life can be. You CAN tell it to kids. Every day is a Gift, every day is Precious, and we do not want to miss it!!!
(I know as I am double survivor: meningitis-encephalitis when I was 17, and brain aneurysm+subarchanoid hemorrhage in 2006. Every day is precious, every day is celebration, and we never now when it will END.
Blessings, K., You are The Sorceress!
[ and, you have pupils = her kids :) ]

Right or wrong, I would definitely have a talk with them. I would ask her permission, because she is probably as frustrated as you are with the mess. She just doesn't have the energy to take away from HER fight to fight with her kids. She may consider it a huge favor. The kids may be so distraught that they don't notice the mess.
I have a friend who has Non-Hodgkins lymphoma. She has 2 adult kids who would never help out until we sat down with them (and Dad) and told them how important it was to support Mom so she could use her energy to get well.
If the kids understand how important it is, they may take the HINT and do a little work to help their Mother.
Keep being the good neighbor and I honor your compassionate spirit.

K.,

If you are feeling that the children should assist you and their mother, follow through and ask them if they would like to join you in helping out around the house.

Please kept it as a suggestion. These children are experiencing something that I can only imagine as the most challenging experience. Their keeping busy will not only support their mother and you, but assist them in feeling that have some control of a situation. Cancer is one of the diseases that affects everyone around it. The sense of lack of control is the main effect.

With my whole heart, C.

K.,
I'm so glad that Debbie has a neighbor like you. Honestly, I don't think you should ask the kids. Right now, their world has been turned upside down- first with the move and now their mom is at a very critical stage with cancer. They probably need to be able to concentrate on spending more time with their mom. Maybe you can talk to some of the other neighbors and see if them are able to go help out with the chores. Especially with them being children, they are processing a lot right now and need to be able to cope in their own way. I think you are doing the right thing by being there- I think that's more what they need right now. I'll keep Debbie and her family in my prayers- again THANK YOU for being there for them.

Be a good neighbor. Hopefully they will see through your example that she needs help around the house. Have her check out Gerson.org, There is another alternative to cancer treatment than Chemo and Radiation.

OK- Don't imply that their mom will get better if they clean up; don't imply that their mom will stay sick (or got sick) because it's messy. Do invite them to work beside you - gently, kindly, lovingly - don't yell at them, lecture them, or chew them out at all.
Sorry this is so prescriptive, but I've been a sick mom with a messy house, and people coming to help can be so hurtful sometimes, that you wish they hadn't even come - and others, who achieve the same results or better, serve as mentors for your entire family. The difference is really love. And children are very sensitive to if you're just pretending to feel kindly toward them.
In short, only say something if you can do so in a way that will actually make the situation better, rather than causing awkwardness and resentment which will build up and backfire.
-N Wilson

when i have had surgeries and other women have come to my home to help, i really appreciated them involving my kids in the cleaning and cooking. but because of the ages of your neighbor's kids, i would ask the mother first before talking to the kids or inviting them to help you. if they've had their mom do most of the work, they will need some instruction on how to do things, not just told to do it. so find out first from the mom what they really know how to do. she may prefer to talk with them herself. and thank you for helping another mom like this!

look into www.flylady.com, (or .net)
there you will learn how to teach housecleaning as a routine to yourself or someone else in short 15 minute tasks at a time.

I'm going to throw out my 2 cents here not because I have experience with cancer, but with teenagers. I would agree that 1) you ask Debbie if you can help get her kids on board to help out around the house, and 2) that you do talk to the kids. Most teens aren't wired to look beyond their own little shells so they probably don't see what needs to be done. They just need some loving encouragement to take some responsibility and show them what their mom needs done to help make her feel better.

I think if you are helping her out from the kindness of your heart, you definately have no place to be judging her nor her children. That would definately lie soley on their parents to get them motivated to assist in the household chores.

I would for sure...go over there and take them outside and go for a walk....And tell them that you care about them and their mom and theres only so much that you can do....And just ask, is theres something that you can do to help things run more smoothly in the house with chores? See if you can get them to volenter to do things...Each kid washes there own clothes or work together as a team. Mom is not feeling well, and shes not going to want to see her house fall apart in front of her while shes feeling like shes falling arpart....Tell them there mom needs them more then anything at this point...and her seeing them step up will mean the world to her...Good luck Update me.
J.

I think that the kids can help out. I know that it is probably hard on them dealing with their mother's health condition. Offer them support to be an ear for them as well. Tell them their mom will appreciate their help and something that will make her feel good about the house being in order. Ask them what they can do to help out. Everyone washes and put away their own laundry. They can pitch in to get dinner ready. Everyone can pick up after themselves and help clean the house. Helping them with a chore list is a great idea. Good luck. You are such a good friend and neighbor.

Ask Debbie if it's okay to ask the kids to help you.

Clearly they've never learned how to do chores, so you're going to have to give them specific instructions. What a shame. I was raised like that too. It didn't come in handy when I went to college and had roommates who had to put up with me. I've since become neat and clean.

The kids are dealing with a lot right now too. There must be a lot of confusion and uncertainty. It's okay to gently ask them to help keep their house nice and take some stress off of their mom who needs to focus on being as well as possible. It wouldn't be a good idea to ride them too hard though. The best approach may be to set the example and pull them into teamwork when you're there helping out. It's definitely a sensitive situation and it's good that you're thinking of their feelings. You must be a great neighbor!

Keep in mind that her kids are suffering along with her. It's not easy to see someone you love sick (or dying), and when it's their mother, and they are still young (emotional and cognitive development are still in process until at least early 20s) it's got to be doubly hard for them. It may be that they don't think of it, either because they're teens (that's a normal teenage thing) or because they have so much else going on in their lives.
It may not hurt to bring it up with their mom, maybe she has some idea of how much they could be doing (and are doing). But I would say, it's better for them to spend time with mom than cleaning or doing dishes. You're an angel sent to them, being so willing to help out! And if you can, maybe build some relationship with the kids. No matter the outcome of their mom's illness, they will benefit from having another caring adult in their lives who they can talk to or go to for advice.

I agree that people are the priority here. Help out cleaning where you can, I'm sure she appreciates it. But cleaning goes WAY down the priority list when an illness gets involved like this. My house gets pretty bad just when I'm pregnant, I can only imagine if I had to go through what your friend does. Maybe it would be an idea to buy her a bunch of paper plates, bowls, cups, etc. so they don't have to do as many dishes.

It is so wonderful that you are there for her. I know that she appreciates it. You should talk to the kids, but in a kind, non accusatory way. Remember that this is devastating for them too, and they probably do not know what to do, and we all know that teenagers are not self starters. The husband is probably dealing with enough, so I dont think that it is out of line to say something kind to the kids. But dont be upset if it changes nothing. Remember what kids have to go through, home work, jobs, peer pressure, and now there mom may be dying. Dishes are probably not high on their list of problems to keep under control. Keep up what you are doing, you are lifting their family in more ways than you can imagine.

Nope. Definitely NOT your place.

If you help, that's great. If you tell them to do it, you're being judgmental and overstepping into a parent's role. I have a daughter on palliative care atm. I can tell you cleaning the house isn't at the top of my list.

If other things matter more to their family right now, that's their choice.

Please continue to help. Don't overstep or judge.

I would approach this situation by talking to your neighbor to see how you could best help out. I have found that it is best to be honest with friends. I have one friend that gets very offended if I help with her kids but one friend who loves if I start helping her parent because her kids don't listen to her. It's one thing to go over and just lay it out what they should or shouldn't be doing but quite another to go over and spend a few minutes discussing how the kids are feeling, what they think would help their mom most. Sometimes just a suggestion of what is appropriate or what might be most helpful to mom is all that's needed. I imagine that they are drowning in feelings and just don't know where to start or what really needs to be done. It sounds like they should really be spending as much time with mom as possible but just maybe need to think about how having a clean house will also help her because she can have confidence that when she's gone things will be taken care of. Even if the dishes aren't washed if they are all in the sink that's helpful. Then someone like you can come over and get them done. Same with clothes. At this point dusting and a clean toilet are just pluses.

You are a great neighbor! I would casually and politely mention it to the kids away from their mother. I just know from experience being sick for periods of time that it would be a great help and very nice if after I got better I wouldn't have a house that looks like I have been gone. You could just say it would make their mom proud of them and very happy if they could up keep the house while is going through this difficult time.

K., you are a good friend and neighbor to help in the way you do. That family will remember your good deeds for a very long time.

I encourage you to keep on as you are doing and dont contribute your opinion in this area for the main reason that this family is in crisis mode, under an extreme amount of stress and simply put, they are doing the best they can. When a family is on overload like this, some things like dishes and laundry just arent as important anymore.

I dont know who wrote it but "standards of cleanliness" has nothing to do with it - were they serious when they wrote that???? I could just cry at how some people are so insensitive. ugh.

Her kids may not appear affected but they in fact are very deeply affected - how could they not be? Kids have all kinds of mechanisms for coping with tragedy and denial could feel like a very safe place to live right now.

If you feel like you are doing too much, why not ask your other neighbors if they might be able to help too? Go to your neighbors and ask them if they would be willing to help and what kind of things they could do for the family. Then, go to your friend and her husband and encourage them with the fact that they are not alone and that their friends on the street are offering to help. Perhaps a family could pick a day where it was their job to check in with the family and do something they saw needed to be done when they were there - it could be to put in a load of dishes or laundry or put something in the oven for dinner or simply take the kids to do something fun. It might be as simple as having a quiet visit and brightening their day a little.

You definitely have the gift of mercy and service, K.. God bless you!

C.

My Mom is in stage 4 lung cancer as well. She has lived almost two years with it while my father passed away after only 3 months. It is a horrible thing! You are so such a blessing for that family. The fatigue from chemo is debilitating. Thank you for them. You are such a wonderful person to take the time out of your schedule to help out. I have a 4 & 6 year old and that takes alot of time and patience. I agree with a gentle talk with the childrem would be great. I think sometimes to hear something like that from an outsider would be helpful. Not like a parent - teens find anything a parent says nagging.

I just wanted to tell you again how great and special you are to help this family.

God Bless.

I'd say that you can speak up. If you're going over there often to help out, picking up a few things, doing housework, why can't you talk to HER kids about helping around THEIR house? Better still, where is Dad in all of this-why hasn't he stepped up. He's probably grieving his wife already but he's still got 3 kids to take care of. God bless you for being caring & willing enough to go help them out!
Maybe you could grab a random kid while you're doing dishes-I'll wash, you dry-or laundry-I'll put these in the washer, you throw in the softener & put it in the dryer & come get me to help fold... maybe if they're helping you instead of you telling them what to do, it'll go over better.

It would be a gift if you could talk to the kids. If you frame it in a conversation about "what they could do to help mom out", instead of something they should have done, that can give them a way to see it as something they want to do, instead of a punishment they bear for their mom's illness. You never know where they may be emotionally about their mom--if they are in denial, talking may help give them something to do that opens things up for them all.

Since the family is new to the neighborhood I'm guessing the 'standard of cleanliness' in their home is not a given. Meaning you don't know how clean or messy they usually keep things. Some people put more priority on happy kids than a spotless home.

Is it your place to parent the children into doing chores? Most certainly no. Again, the parents' expectation of what the children will and won't do around the house is theirs. Debbie is fighting for her life and her priorities are different at this point.

I'd suggest talking to Debbie and asking her what help she needs or wants and stick to it. Its very nice of you to want to help out, maybe buying a package of paper plates would help more than offering to do dishes? Or just being present for her? I guess thats the big question in my mind, what does Debbie need or want from you?

Sorry to hear the family is going through this... my heart is breaking for the kids. GL!

hey there,
What a tough spot to be in and good for ou for helping!
I think I would maybe gently mention it. Maybe is there a time when the all come home after school together? Mabe say something like, "Hey I'm not sure where this goes, could you guys maybe help me out with some of this stuff?" Thats difficult, because you hear so many people talking about not worrying about that kind of stuff because time is so short(esp if its stage IV) but at the same time, I am a firm believer in order and if things are in order in my house, I feel better. Maybe relay that to them as well. Good Luck!

These situations are always a bit 'sticky'. You have to think about the possibilty that her husband and kids are caring specifically for her and not worrying about the condition of the house. She may want her family to coduct business as usual. Myself, I would just ask her directly if she would like you to speak with her kids and designate specific chores to them. I cared for my father who had esophogeal cancer and lived alone and although I did do household chores he was my first priority. You could also ask her if she would mind if you got a few other people together to help her out once or twice a week. Regardless of whether or not the kids do start helping, you will never regret your generous act of neighborly service.

Just give the kids a hug. Their mom is dying. Stage 4 lung cancer is bad. Google it.

Ask her if she wants you to bug the kids about doing some cleaning, but if she says no then just be a good neighbor.

It's still her family, and her right to run it how she chooses.

I think you can, in a very kind and non-threatening way, tell the kids that it would help out there mom a lot if they would help around the house. I do not think this is overstepping your boundaries at all. You can explain to them that their mom is in a lot of pain and the chemo makes it worse and she really needs them right now, in addition to continue to going over and helping out. Good luck and God bless! I will keep your neighbor and her family in my heart and prayers!

I would definately talk to the kids about helping out. They are plenty old enough. I get my 5 year old to pick up the front room and my 14 year old to vacuum. They don't do it unless they are made to and this may be the problem here. My 18 year old is a great help, but she also needs a little push. Maybe talking to these kids is the push that they need. It will help her attitude SO much! It helps everyone when they wake up to a clean house. Maybe you can get them to help you when you go over there to begin with and then it will catch on.

K.,
Boy, this is a hard one! The father should be asking the kids to help out...it should not HAVE to be you that talks to them about it. But, someone should be talking about it with them....so maybe if you were able to talk to them about how much it would help their mom to have a little help, they might be good about doing some of the work. This is a hard age to start learning to help out, it should have been happening already, but maybe if you have a relationship to them that they would listen to you, you might have some positive results. Maybe "plant a seed" in their heads!!
Good luck!

Hi K., I would talk to the husband and suggest he talk to them. Just tell him it would make the wife feel so much better. If nothing happens after that just leave it and be the good niegbor.

Good luck, T.