Bitter, Angry Birth mom...not Sure I Can Cope with Her Any Longer.

I've been told, in the past (a year or two ago) that at that age a child can make the decision about whether or not they want to spend time with a parent. I would definitely check into it. Unfortunately, depending on the age of the other child(ren), they might not have a choice yet.

I had the same problem only with my ex-husband. Toxic toxic. Took about 9 yrs for him to calm the hell down. There are few things I can suggest (all of which I thought of) - continue to utilize the court system to mitigate her behavior. File a complaint about her behavior - document it so you have it to show in court. Threaten to file a restraining order against her for abusive behavior. Insist that the Judge mandate anger management and parenting classes for her. That I know you can do because I had to do that with my ex.

Re: the kids: The kicker here is that if they are age 12 or over they get to choose who they stay with. The parent's no longer can tell them they have to be with this parent or that. The kids, if they are sick of moms behavior could be encouraged to sit down with mom, with a mediator, and say "Knock it off or we go to dad's full time." My kids have done this twice with their father - and it worked.

This is a tough situation you are in - very tough. No one wins here - least of all the kids, and their mother is losing in ways she doesn't even realize. As long as you and your partner stay calm - do not retaliate or behave in the same manner as the ex - the kids will know who is who and what is what - if you catch my drift. My kids love their father very much - but if they need something, they come to me. They know who has the strength and ability to get things done in a timely and proper manner. :)

I wish you much luck...say a prayer for the mother - be very compassionate - and I know that is hard to do. Clearly something is up with her that has her that angry...that distant. I feel for her and I feel for your family...

Warmly,
J.

Dear C.,

I hope this will help....looking at both sides.

Your “partner” and his former wife been divorced for nine years. The fourteen year old son was five years old when the marriage ended. Were other children older or younger? Was your “partner” involved in extra marital affairs prior to separation and divorce? If the answer is yes, that may be part of the reason why she is still unable to move on with her own life. At the time of their divorce were you “the other woman?”

Being left alone with small children can be pretty tough. Add that to being left alone for another woman, who may be perceived as younger, prettier, smarter, sexier, etc., is painful, humiliating and can send a woman over the edge. Some women recover and move on, some never do; especially those who signed on for the long haul. Even though they knew there was trouble in the marriage never suspected it would end in divorce?

I would suggest putting a block on her email address and start communicating through a third party unless there is a family emergency. You may be able to have a court ordered mediator and certain rules and guidelines put into force. If they are violated by either party, there could be serious consequences.

It is regrettable that a mother doesn’t want to participate in the school community, but again, if she has to run into her former husband and his girlfriend or second wife, it may be more then she can handle. If this is the case they might consider alternating events or agreeing to attend at different times. (I realize this may not always be possible).

Your “partner” may maintain an unbelievable level of patience with his former wife because he feels a certain level of guilt. He knows the most important thing right now is what is best for the children. The less drama they have to see between their parents, the better off they will be. The fourteen year old said he doesn’t like his mother as a “person.” I suspect he still loves her as his mother and is at an age where he is probably hurt, frightened and concerned about her emotional health.

I pray that things will improve for everyone concerned.

Blessings…..

First, remember that you are not the first to go through this.
Second, get this book right now: Divorce Poison. Look up the full citation on Amazon.com, then request it from your local library, or just buy it. Read the reviews (and discussions) on Amazon.com and look for some of the other books on this topic. _Divorce Poison_ has so many stories that exemplify specific troubling behaviors and how spouses learned to respond better. I actually think this book is a great parenting book because it really teaches you to recognize and not put up with people treating you badly... *and* it shows you how to teach your kids to recognize bad behavior in others, set personal boundaries, and respond appropriately. Good luck! -- C

My first thought would be to look at the law book. Check your states age limit for when a child can choose which parent they want to live with. In Texas it is really young like 14. Don't quote that but I can recall being surprised at how young the child was and yet still be of age by the court to choose which parent they wanted to reside with.

I believe at age 13 the kids have the legal right to state which parent they wish to have custody, and that the courts honor the child's wishes beyond that age. Might be something to look into. That said, my parent's divorce was back in the days before the courts found that it was harmful to have children testify during custody cases, and I remember being 4 or 5 years old and sitting on the witness stand and watching my father cry as I told the court I wanted to live with my mom. It was difficult. Good luck.

Oh my goodness! First of all my thoughts and prayers are with you and your family as you navigate through this sticky/stinky situation!

Above all else the children come first! I would suggest that you get them counseling to help them deal with their Mother. Especially if the one stated that he doesn't like the way she is. Help them deal with the negativity so they can grow up to not repeat the Mother's behavior!

Secondly, if my memory serves me right (which sometimes it doesn't these days), once a child is 12 they can tell a judge which parent they want to live with full time. Your partner/husband needs to seriously think about this. Is it better to have them exposed to such hateful and negative behavior or would it be best for the children to have a loving and non toxic home to thrive in? These things are hard! I couldn't imagine being cut off from my kids! But, the kids come first!

Have you tried mitigation with the mother to try to put her behavior in check? Sometimes people cannot see their own illnesses/weaknesses/bad behavior. Maybe taking this situation out of your husband’s hands and into the hands of the law may make this easier on him and his kids. Taking blame from him and onto the law.

Or you could just ask Dr. Phil!

At any rate I wish you the best of luck with this situation!

As for the kids, they have you and their Dad. Maintain a consistent loving patient home for them there and they will always know that. As to Mom, I would simply refuse to communicate with her when she starts a tirade. Just say "we'll continue this when you calm down" and hang up. Dont read her e mails if they are that volitile. Write her an e amil that says you will not read any e mail that contains negativity. If she continues, take one of her e mails and correct it with red ink and return it to her. If she continues, just send them back. and tell her you will read them when they are nicer.

is the mother mentally abusing the kids, too? if not, i don't see where there would be a case. i mean you can do a violation if there is an order at court saying she can't do these things. and if you feel that this is really affecting your kids mentally, etc. than definitely at least try. i worked in family law in fl and the only time that the judges could make a change in custody was if there was a significant change in circumstances. if she's always been this way, i don't know? also, i'm not sure if the 13 age thing matters anymore either. it's entirely up to the judge typically.

A good friend of mine was in the exact same situation with her husband and his ex-wife. She was toxic, they suspected she was mentally ill, and then when the kids were 20 and 17, the younger son came home to find her hanging from the rafters. She'd left a note saying she specifically killed herself when she knew he'd be coming home from school so he could get her down and call the police before her second husband came home with their younger son. It was sad that after all the years of trying to get her help, she died in that way, toxic to her children until the end.
All the previous years, however, my friend and her husband took their lead from the kids. They approached the kids gently and had a discussion about spending more time at their home, how would they feel about that, etc., and they also discussed when they'd prefer to spend time with their mom. As it turns out, their mom was usually a lot of fun, and less crazy, during the holidays when her extended family was all their. So, they made sure the kids got to spend most holidays with her so that the time they did spend with her would likely be filled with good memories. They considered it a small price to pay for having the kids most of the rest of the time. My friend and her husband went to court with tapes of nasty, mean voicemails the ex-wife had left, and asked for primary custody, telling the court they were willing to let the ex have all the family holidays in exchange for letting the kids live with them full time--and they made sure to never discuss how the case was proceeding in court in front of the kids. As the stepmom, my friend just tried to make sure she was a safe haven and a shelter of support for the kids. She never badmouthed the mom, never talked about court or anything, and the kids really appreciated it and thrived.
I'd try to get full custody and then just support the kids as best as you can...Good luck!!

This is the price you pay for being with a man who either made a bad choice previously or treated the mother of his children poorly. . . . trying to take a mother away from her children only seems to be something that will increase the hatred and hurt further. What can you do to make the situation better not worse? Hopefully you didn't play part in him leaving her, otherwise you really have asked for your situation.
Sorry, but you have a lot of blind support here, and so I choose to play Devil's Advocate and not assume you are so innocent. As one of the other posters suggested, there may be a good reason this woman hates you and the father so much, and I am not willing to support you without the facts. Men often cause a lot of hurt by leaving their families, and if you signed on for a man that left, you need to accept some responsiblity for who your married and see if you can be a positive force here and not hurt this woman and the children more. This is not a game for you to win, its a time for you to promote healing.

I haven't been in your situation...but my sister has..but fortunately, the ex has settled down a bit....

If your kids are in thier teenage years maybe they have more of a voice. I would document everything....I would also do as less as possible wiht her involved...only due what the courts have asked for..do not go above and beyond...which I am sure you husband has.

I would sit down with the kids and see what their veiw is and what they would like to see happen...I am sure they love the mom the used to have and don't like the person they see now.

I am sure the older kids have a right to deny going to her visitations.

I would also call CASA and see if they can step in, so they can get and unbiased view of what is going on and maybe with thier input can get things changed in court.

Hope that helps.

If you decide to pursue her with your attorney or through the authorities like CPS, it is very helpful to keep a journal where you document the dates, times, phone calls, text messages, etc. and most importantly, her behavior, reactions, etc. Keeping a paper trail will help you present your case in court and it also helps if you see a counselor. Plus, if you see it on paper, it really reinforces just how bad she is acting.

Good luck,

M

I don't know the legal answer to your question, but I would think it would be. Keep records of the behavior, and print out copies of the e-mails for the court. Courts usually listen to the kids' wishes after age 12, so if your stepson wants to live with his father full time, the court may grant his wish.

Well, first off, you have to keep in mind that, as far as law is concerned, she's not "birth mom," she's mom, and there is no "we" in regards to the joint custody. Your husband has it. And it's not "his kids," it's "their kids." Some judges will mentally ding parents who say "my kids" instead of "our kids."

I am not a lawyer, so this is not legal advice, but rather suggestion based on my advocacy in juvenile and family courts in California. I suggest your husband asking for temporary modification asking for sole custody based on their mother's based on potentially abusive behavior (the attempts at emotionally-blackmailing and guilt-tripping the kids) with every other weekend visits with mom and phone calls during the week as often as the kids want them to last, and custody to return to the order it is now if she stops her abusive, nasty behavior.

If the kids are in their pre-teen years or older, which at least the 14-year-old is, he can write a letter to the judge outlining his wishes and the reason for them, and his dad can present that in court. A judge doesn't have to abide by the wishes of a minor ever even if that minor is 17, but many judges will give heavy consideration to a minor's wishes, especially when the reason is feeling guilty with a parent, feeling blackmailed, etc.. Not so much if a kid wants to be with one parent because that parent lets the kid do whatever the kid wants, but when there's behavior that can be considered abusive, then it's a different case.

Even if you had come between husband and wife (which your edit says you didn't), she absolutely should not be hurting the kids like this.

Some of that behavior would be considered abusive by the courts, you may be able to get custody. I hope...
Sorry - that is such a tough situation!!

Geez, I don' t know for sure but I would think that it is. If she has this much anger, who knows what she's doing or saying around and to the kids?? I grew up with a mentally ill mom and my sister and I are still very traumatized by it. I have luckily been less scathed but my sister has become non-functional with depression/ocd. Get the kids out ASAP. Look up legal resources, etc. I'm pretty sure something can be done. Good luck.

Wow! That must be extremely hard to deal with. I think if it is detrimentally affecting the kids, then it is worth going to court over. The kids, if they are over 12, will get to have some say. They can meet with a mediator and let their feelings be known. Also, you might think about a restraining order restraining her from contacting you except in regards to the children's visitation.