I am not looking for condemnation from anyone who advocates for taking pacifiers away at an early age. I am looking for information from other parents with kids who are 4 or older who either still suck their thumb, or who still have a pacifier. This is not a question about whether I should have allowed him to have his binky this long, nor do I need to be told I should have taken it from him a long time ago. I let him have it, and I don't regret that. I am only asking about what will happen from this point forward.
I've posted about this in the past, some of you may remember, as I *came clean* on allowing my 4 year old son (gasp) to have his binky. He recently turned 5, and we decided together that we'd limit binky time to bed time ONLY. We had tried to limit it in the past, but regardless of the limits we'd set, he'd end up having his binky throughout the day, as he wanted it. But we have stuck with our recent arrangement for at least 2 full weeks now, he hands over his binky when he gets out of bed, and doesn't get it back until he goes back to bed. It seemed that this was going pretty well, as he didn't cry for it through the day, only asked for it on occasion, and sometimes even jokingly, knowing I wasn't going to give it to him.
So, here are my issues. My mother watches my son 3 days a week when I work, and she has him for pretty long days, as I work 10 hours, travel 2, rendering me gone for 12+ hours on these days. Plus, I leave my house at 6 a.m., so my son sleeps at my mom's on the nights before I work, so they don't have to be up at the crack of dawn. We are all good with this arrangement. I mention this because my mom deals with my son for a lot of hours during the week, and she has her own motivation for her actions... Anyhow, on a couple of occasions, I walked into my mom's house, to see my son with his binky. And I ask why he has it, and get some dumb excuse. And then she'll take it from him, and he whines about it at that point (naturally.) So the other day, same thing. It was 7:30 and my son had his binky and was sitting on the couch watching something on tv. I asked why he had his binky, and my mom said, "because it's night night time." I said, "since when does he go to bed at 7:30?" (He rarely goes to sleep before 9.) She said, well he's laying down, and I thought he's allowed to have his binky at night night time?" I said "BED time. Not in the evenings while lounging on the couch." So she begrudgingly took it from him again, and of course, he was upset, again.
So the other day, my mom said she wanted to talk to me about his binky, saying in a nutshell that she thought I should let him have it. She thinks that he'll just choose to give it up on his own, probably sooner than later, and that she felt so bad that I took his one comfort/security from him. I argued back that I do not think he'll decide on his own to give it up, as he has not yet given any indication that he could make that choice for himself. He had even begun hiding it from people, showing that he realized that it was frowned upon, but still not wanting to just hand it over. My mom said that he has been having a really hard time, and that was being demonstrated by his irritability, he's doing things he doesn't usually do, being more physically hyper, putting everything in his mouth, and just being generally cranky and whiny. Which is true. But he also has an ear infection, so it is impossible to say for sure how much of his behavioral change is due solely to the binky. I also explained to her that I didn't think that a period of time to adjust to not having his binky all day was not at all unexpected. That I expected him to be a little more irritable and cranky than usual, but that I also expect that to level off as he gets more used to coping without his binky. If he were incolsolable, that would be one thing, but he's not. He is definitely cranky, but barely asks for his binky, if at all. To me, he seems to be handling this very well, much better than I expected. My mom thinks that it should have been all or nothing, meaning I shouldn't let him have it at night if he can't have it through the day, that that's just confusing him. I disagree. I think it's a good way to transition, and it lets him have his comfort at night to fall asleep. Then I take it out, and if he finds it in the middle of the night to fall back asleep, fine.
One of my fears is that he'll resort to sucking his thumb/finger (like I did) because while I can take his binky away, I can't take his thumb away, and I have no idea how I'd get him to stop thumb sucking. I sucked mine way, WAY longer than I'm willing to admit (after my binky was taken away at 4). And my mom, who has been undermining this process from the beginning based on her disagreement with my decision, even basically suggested that to him yesterday. I could have choked her. My son had wrapped himself in a big blanket, and I was holding him like a baby, and saying things to him and my mom like he was a tiny baby, just playing with him, and he was giggling and laughing at what I was saying, like, "does my baby have poopoo in his pants?" Or, "Nanny, did you know my tiny baby can say 'Mama'?" And a few other things like that, and she was saying some things too, and she actually said to him, "And does that little baby have a binky?" And I said no, he doesn't need a binky. And she said," Well then, he can suck his thumb because that's what babies do, they suck their thumbs." And she was not saying it in a manner so as to tell him that "babies" suck their thumbs, she used that contextually appropriate opportunity to tell him to suck his thumb. And I've seen him kind of doing it, like he's trying it out. UGH.
So, to get to my questions, if you have a child 4 or older who sucks their thumb/fingers, or a binky, do you plan to just allow them to have it until they decide to stop? Is that reasonable to think they will? Do you think my approach is a bad idea, to limit the binky to bed time only? Do you think he'll adjust to not having the binky through the daytime, and his crankiness will level off?
My mom has me second guessing my decision to take the daytime binky away, even though my son doesn't seem overly affected by that, other than being especially cranky, which I think is to be expected for a while. She, and my aunt both think I should let him have it until HE decides to give it up, regardless of any teeth issues, stigma, etc. I was very liberal with allowing the binky to this point, ignoring all the comments about him having a binky at such an advanced age. But I alwasy kinew there would come a point when I'd decide it was time to take it, and I just felt like maybe the time is now. Now, because of my mother, I'm just not sure if I've done the right thing. And I don't know if my method is cruel, allowing him to have it at night, like I'm torturing him all day, and holding it over his head that he can have it at night, but not during the day. What do you think? How do you plan to help your child stop sucking their thumb/pacifier? Or do you plan to just allow them to do it until they stop? Looking for wisdom from other moms who are in the situation I'm in.
Thanks for reading this way too long post.
I like the *chewing on the toothbrush* idea... might just give that a try, since he does seem to be putting stuff in his mouth...
Just a little fyi - He has chewed holes in some of his binkys and he doesn't like to suck those, they hurt his mouth... so he is exceedingly careful with the ones he has left... But he also knows that new ones can be easily gotten at Walmart.
The new ones can be bought at Walmart ONLY if Grandma buys them. My daughter still sucks her thumb. We've been working on her for over a year! My niece (3y) just gave up her binky because she developed painful thrush and her mom told her it was the binkys. She's been binky free for 3w.
M.
I think as unsightly as it is, let him have it (maybe only at home!) I sucked my thumb until age 5, my teeth are perfect, no problems. My mom tried everything to stop me & i worked around socks sewn on pj sleeves, no bite painted on my nail... I gave it up when ready. Thats what I would do, allow it, but not publicly.
I agree with you - if he's fine thru the day without it, then your mom should be doing as you wish.
I also had a suggestion to help end it completely - do some kind of sleep over with friends, cousins etc for a few days. maybe go camping this summer or something were he is with his peers sharing a sleeping area. He will probably be self conscious and not use it and maybe after a few days of not using, he will relize that he does not need it.
Just throw it away and tell him it broke. My sister in law is 18 and still sucks her finger because no one told her not too. She does it in front of the family and it is pretty gross. so they don't always stop. Just get rid of it so that is is out of mind and out of site. I sucked my thumb until I was in 4th grade. I stopped when I finally was told I could only suck my thumb in my room. So finally it ended.
My BIL is our dentist. And my son was a thumb sucker as soon as he figured out how to get it in his mouth. My BIL told us that most kids will stop with the thumb on their own by the age of 5 (he also mentioned that it can cause dental problems, but it doesn't always). So we didn't stress about it . Then at 4, we had a dental check up and it was discovered that the thumb sucking was causing dental damage and had to stop. We bought a thumb guard (the soft kind) and I hate to admit it, we bribed our child. He wanted a legos set really bad and we told him that as soon as he stopped sucking his thumb at night, we would get it for him. We said he had to be "thumb free" for two weeks straight. When he had a slip up we really didn't make a big deal out of it, we just told him how hard we knew it was and we'd try again. I took him to the store so he could see what he was working for and we looked online. I wanted to keep him motivated. I think it took two weeks before he finally stopped and made it through his two week period. He still found his thumb in his sleep, but we didn't fault him for that. He stopped doing that pretty quickly too. He was so excited about our bribe, that it wasn't a big deal.
When I told my friend about it, she admitted to me that at 6 her daughter was also still using her binky. It was a famiy secret, they didn't tell anyone. Her mother said she just kept thinking it would be given up. And at around five her daughter started only using it at night, so she thought it was on it's way out the door. When they went in for a check up with a new dentist, the first thing she said to them was "The pacifier needs to go...today." She said the first two days were the hardest, her daughter was absolutely devastated. They also kept finding her with binkies. She would search high and low for the ones that were lost and hoard them in her room. Her mother also mentioned that her behavior was pretty bad for about a week and it was getting worse. Not only was she emotionally upset, but she wasn't sleeping as soundly as before. So they bought her a noise machine and a snugglie stuffed animal and they also decided to bribe her. Go one week without a pacifier and you'll get that American Girl doll you want so bad. She survived the week, got her doll and didn't miss the pacifier. It's tough, but he will survive it. It sounds like you just need to get mom on board with your plan.
My newly turned 5 yo is a bedtime thumbsucker. She voluntarily gave up pacifiers when she was 3 when she switched to her thumb. I only allow it 'in bed, when falling asleep'. Not allowed in front of tv, in car, or anywhere else.
I've noticed that once she falls asleep, the actual amount of time that her thumb is in her mouth is limited. More often than not, she'll move while sleeping and the hand will go somewhere else. Her dentist said he isn't worried about it that much right now because her bite shows only a slight impact from it--because it's not hours and hours, just a little while sleeping.
We've promised that if she stops, we'll get her a pet... She's got to be a "big girl" to take care of a pet.
As for your mom, she needs to support you. Yes, letting him do it makes it easier on her when she watches him, but good parenting does mean taking the "easy way". I've told my daughter that she can chew/gnaw on her toothbrush (no toothpaste) if she wants to sit in front of the tv with something in her mouth--at least gnawing on a toothbrush will help get her teeth clean! Sometimes I give her gum to occupy her oral fixation... She won't suck her thumb if gum is in her mouth.
Good luck!
Fist of all. My 5 year old shows no signs of stopping her finger sucking. I have often wished it was a binky so I could could have tossed it at a few months old, which is what we did for all of ours. She was finger sucking instead of the binky already at that point. I ignore it, because I cant' stop it. She removes her fingers right away whenever I tell her to, but they go right back in subconsciously. She does it more if she's cuddling her favorite blanket, which she now no longer gets to cuddle in the car, etc, only at night. So it has reduced quite a bit. I'm worried for her teeth. And I wish she would outgrow it. It's one of the few bad habits we never stopped with enforcement early on, and now it's one of the few bad habits she has. Fair enough.
As for how I would handle my mom in your scenario (mind you my mom doesn't watch my kids because she lives very far away....) I would remind her she had absolutely no say in what my kids did.
BUT. If she was always watching them, I'd probably let her do it her way when she had them, and do it my way when I had them.
You're not cruel to take it away. He's doing well with not having it during the day with you, why back track? If he starts sucking his thumb it's no worse.
BUT!!! As for your mom suggesting to him to suck his thumb??!!!??!-that would need scolding. But it's hard to control a mom. So I say just let him be a half binky user-he can do the binky with grandma all day long, and she can stop pressuring you about it. Over time she'll see it's not better that he has a binky at her house, when he's fine without at all other times except night.
My daughter sucked her thumb and her younger sister had a binky. The thumb sucker wanted to stop but couldn't until the dentist forced the issue at 8yrs old by installing an appliance in the roof of her mouth to widen her palate and stop thumb sucking and she will absolutley need braces!
My youngest we did the bibky only at bedtime thing and then we gave binky to a baby who needed it by tying to balloon and sending off into sky for new baby, when she was 3.
My son had his pacifier until he was 4yrs 4mo. I didn't plan on him having it that long, but he did. He only had it at night (and that started when he was about 2) and didn't have a problem with it. He knew that it was only a bedtime thing, wasn't confused. He actually had 2 pacifiers for a while, he like to hold one and suck one. One day I noticed one had a small hole in the base where the nipple attaches to the plactic guard, I told him that one was worn out and time to be thrown away. He was sad and I had to explain that is wasn't safe to suck on a pacifier with a hole. So, I later told him that when the other one wore out, it was time to throw it away and be done with pacifiers. About a month or so later I took the scissors and snipped a hole in the base of his last one and put it back in his bed (his pacifiers just stayed in bed) when he went to bed that night he found it, noticed the hole, brought it to me and showed me, then walked back upstairs. I heard him cry for less than a minute, I went upstairs and he was in his room not crying, but sad. I asked what was wrong, he made something up completely unrelated to the pacifier. I asked where the pacifier was, he said in the trash and that was the end of it. For my son it was better that he knew the plan and knew the day was coming and he was fine.
Good luck! It sounds like to me, your son could switch to just nights, but he has learned that he can get it from Grandma. You've got to figure out how to get your mom to agree since he is there a lot.
Sucking is a natural instinct which is supposed to go away around age 4/5 years.
Which is why the natural folk nurse their children until that age. 4 years is BTW also the global average of weaning children from the breast.
Since sucking thumb or toys or whatever is only a substitute, I would imagine it to decrese and cease as well around that age. Without force. Just because the child enters a new developmental stage.
My now 14 year old used a binky right up to around 5. She was a stubborn kiddo! I also had to hear the criticism about her being too old for a binky. I finally got to the point where I just decided now is the time and one day I braced myself and put them all up out of sight and was waiting for the aftermath.....and I kind of found it funny, but for the great BIG DEAL I made it in my head about taking it away, it really was a non-event. It was not as bad as I had thought it was going to be. I have noticed over the years though, that unlike my other kids, she seems to have THINGS she gets really attached to....like she still has her baby blanket that she won't let me wash because she is scared it will get more worn out....and she has a bunny that she has been sleeping with since I gave it to her on easter YEARS ago.
I guess what I am saying is that for me, it was better to just take it away totally and see how it goes...which it went well...and I am sure that if your son needs a comfort item, he will find something else to attach to.
Sounds like you and mom need to talk this out some more too, because she stepped on your toes and that wasn't right.
Good luck!!
K.
I have a five and a half year old boy that still sucks his thumb and it is soooo hard to get him to stop. I have tried taking the same route as you and told him he can only suck his thumb when he's in bed (after all I can't really stop him, can't take the thumb away). This has been and still is a struggle. He only sucks in bed until he is asleep then it falls out.
In the daytime however I have to constantly remind him not to suck his thumb. It truly is constant, he doesn't even realise he's suckign it until I tell him to take it out. I soooooooo wish he had a binky that I could take away during the day.
I do tell him to take his thumb out though and I will continue to tell him until he stops putting it in his mouth. He sucks it in the car A LOT and when he talks to me I just say sorry I don't understand what you're saying, do you have your thumb in your mouth.
If you he still needs it at night time then that is fine, you are not torturing him during the day. Kds will do what they can get away with, when he is with grandma he gets away with more. She needs to respect your wishes and back you up. She is making it worse by not playing by the rules you have set for him. Don't second guess yourself. Your child = your rules. Good luck :)
I sucked my thumb until I was 5 or 6. I quit doing it when I realized that I looked silly doing it. I was old enough to make that decision myself and I'm glad that my mother didn't try to force me not to. I do have to say however, that my mouth full of teeth suffered because of it. Years of thumb sucking resulted in a retainer and headgear to correct my horrendous overbite.
I got lucky with my kids, they just gave up their pacifier when they were ready - except my youngest - DH left it at home when we sent her to her grandparents for a long weekend. We used that opportunity to tell her it was missing. She got over it. It took a couple weeks, but she doesn't ask for it anymore.
Good luck!
I answered the toddler bottle question before I got to your post so I won't write my whole novel over! You can read that horror story later if you want! LOL!
You made the consious decision to let him have it until now without second guessing yourself. GIVE YOURSELF THE SAME COURTESY NOW! If you want it gone, let it be gone. He's going to suck his thumb whether he has a binky or not (thanks mom!).
If your mom is so worried about it, do what every parent does when it comes to grandparents (we all know they sneak (and sometimes blatently NOT sneak) the candy and soda). Tell him, at nana's house she may let you have your binky, but not here! Period. Then have your mom have all of his binks. After the 'only at nana's house' transition, then maybe you can talk some sense into her and have HER throw them all away.
Also, do you think he is too old for the 'cut an x in the end of the binky so it won't work anymore' scenerio? If it's broken and you don't have anymore (send him to nana's with a broken one too) he might just let it go himself.
I know a tough issue! My daughter started sucking her thumb because we took the binky away too soon...ah sigh....Constant battle now to get her to stop...
My second child DS is three. We have limited the binky to bedtime. Tried to take it away all together and then he started to have accidents and going potty too frequently like every 5 minutes. He is completely potty trained. We gave it back to him for bedtime and since then he is back to normal.
I do believe that he will outgrow it but I would limit it to bedtime. I am learning to pick my battles carefully. I highly doubt as he gets older that he will want his friends to know he has a binky :)
I was the kid who sucked their thumb well past the age of 5 - maybe until age 7, I can't remember exactly and I think I finally gave it up on my own. Years and years of orthodontic work afterwords was the result, trying to correct the overbite all that thumb sucking created. I could make a mobile from all the retainers and appliances I had to wear.
My DD had her pacifier until just before her 3rd birthday. We just decided it was time for it to be taken away by the Binky Fairy because she was a big girl now and the Binky Fairy needed it for a new baby. She got a big girl present in return and fortunately has not taken to sucking her thumb instead.
Does your son see a dentist regularly? Would you ask them what they think?
My oldest daughter, now 25, sucked her thumb until she was 11 years old - Even still sucking it while asleep with orthodontic appliances in her mouth. Her teeth were a mess and her thumb was always bulbous and swollen, with the skin peeling off.
I won't give you advice, but I will tell you that you need to be concerned about more than just comforting him now - My daughter was made fun of at school and did not like to go to sleep overs, because even when she was old enough to WANT to quit, she couldn't. I'm serious, we would try everything and she would still suck her thumb in the middle of night AFTER falling asleep. Socks on her hands, nail biter liquid painted on her thumb, hot sauce, you name it.
She was so embarrassed. If only I had gotten her to quit while she was young, before it became such a physical habit.
Ok... I won't give you the "talk" b/c you've read enough of my responses to know how I feel about binkies...
So here's the "behaviorist" thoughts:
1. He won't give it up on his own at this age unless someone makes fun of him for it. Seriously- he's going to Kindergarten in the fall and sleepovers won't be too far behind.
2. As long as the behavior continues to serve a function, it will continue to exist. In this case, he is sucking on a binky to soothe himself to sleep. If you take away the "function" by snipping a hole in the binkies (and don't buy him more) then the behavior will cease to exist.
3. Even better... if you "replace" the behavior with something more acceptable you will not only eliminate the behavior, but you will help him see that there is more than one way to accomplish an end-goal.
What does that mean? Have a chat with your son and let him know that binkies are for young children and that despite being able to purchase more, he can't have them for much longer. Let him know that when the binkies are "broken", they go in the garbage and won't be replaced. Then... every once in a while, snip them and then toss them.
Yes, he's going to throw a royal fit. Yes, your mom is going to think you're cruel. Yes, you will have a few sleepless nights but... this isn't about the "easy way", it's about the "best thing for you in the long run" way.
Your mom is thinking like a grandmother (and she probably wants some quiet time at the end of the night), not like the person who is supposed to be establishing the boundaries for your children.
Take it away and don't reintroduce it. If your mom can't handle it, then do it over a long weekend so that you and your fiance are the only ones dealing with the fall-out. Make sure that grandma doesn't have any in her home and avoid the baby aisle in stores for a while!
I probably posted on your previous post. I am not the mother of a kid this age with a binky. I WAS the kid that sucked a paci until I was right at 6 years old. It angers me now that my mother didn't take it away from me. The shape of my mouth was a big ol mess, and I wore braces twice to fix a host of mouth problems (which ironically, the orthodontist said was more than likely related to the binky).
Do like my uncle did- He finally had enough. He put Texas Pete on the thing without telling me. When it burned my mouth up, I decided to give it up on my own. My mother would have never taken it away from me, and her reasons for NOT doing so were selfish in my opinion. The right thing to do was to take it from me cold turkey way before the time my uncle stepped in. The sad thing is that I was old enough at that time to remember all of this now, and I am embarrassed by it.
Of course he is going to be irritable without his binky. He will get over it. I did. The question is will you and your family be able to deal with it? Who is the paci really benefiting? You or him?
Hope this gives you a different perspective.
