Not Breathing Scare -- Teeth-Brushing -- Input???

Don't force the toothbrushing...it will only make her hate it, and there will be more fights. My son is 2, and I have to let him know that I'll take something away from him if he doesn't brush his teeth. He loves the Little Einsteins on TV, so if he doesn't brush his teeth, no Little Einsteins. And I stick to it. It works about 95% of the time. The rest I just give up because it doesn't work, but I don't let him watch the Little Einsteins.

With my son (33 months) who is not the most cooperative about brushing, I give him the brush so that he can 'brush' himself first. Then I do it for him. If he resists, I put on his favorite tv show and that usually helps.

Try singing silly made up songs about brushing so that they get involved and it is fun.

Given her scary experience, let her get used to doing it herself for now so that the fear subsides. Also try books/videos from the library by Blues Clues, etc.

Hi S.,
What an ordeal! That must have been scary. I know exactly how you feel, except we ended up in the ER for it. Our 2 1/2 year old had a "tantrum" in the car and basically passed out. She had never done anything like this before and it scared us to death. She was sent home from the ER with a "breath holding spell" diagnosis and appeared to be back to normal the next day. But after we visited our pediatrician the following week, it also turned out she was suffering from anemia which appears to have been brought on by a virus (although she had no other symptoms). However, if I had not done my homework and been familiar with "breath holding spells" and their possible causes, my pediatrician would never have caught the anemia. My husband and I were the ones that brought it to the doctor's attention that anemia might be the culprit, and it turned out in our case we were right on the money... So my advice to you is to go with your instincts if you feel something isn't quite right. It's always better to be cautious but worse to wish you had been...
Oh, and when my 10 year old was a toddler, she reacted the same way your toddler does when it came to brushing her teeth. She even ended up with a couple of cavities. But you know what? It was NO BIG DEAL at all. The cavities didn't hurt, having them filled didn't hurt, and today she's a healthy preteen with normal teeth and good hygene habits... So I wouldn't worry too much about it. Especially since it's causing so much trauma for your little girl.
Hope this helps!
God bless you!

Hello,
This sounds really scary. No wonder she was so frightened!
Our dentist abhorrs this kind of "toothbrushing advocacy", and strongly warns against it. I am so very sorry you received this advice!
I would recommend you find another dentist!
Is this a pediatric dentist?
If our dentist was in the immediate area, I would give you his info.
However, I am SURE you will have no problem in finding many, many other truly good pediatric dentists who do not advocate this type of treatment.
Blessings
Mrs. Gregory

OMG I would have literally FREAKED OUT!!!!! I have a 21 month old and he won't let me "brush" his teeth per se... but he'll try to do it himself, so we just let him..and try to help out every now and then.

I've heard of kids crying so hard that they do pass out... it's not real common but man alive how scary!!!

I don't have any advice... just wanted to say I was thinking of you and YES...call the ped's office or the nurse on call or something and talk to someone about it.. could she have been choking on toothpaste going down her throat? Wow..

Dear S.,
You must have been terrified! Thank goodness your daughter is okay. I HIGHLY recommend you get the book "The Happiest Toddler on the Block" by Dr. Harvey Karp. It should help you end your battles with your toddler. He has been a pediatrician for 21ish years and is amazing in his grasp of what's going on in the little minds that are in toddlers and how to get them to want to do what you want them to do. I also recommend you check out the Dr. William Sears web site. He advocates attatchment parenting and not control parenting. He's also a pediatrician as well as some of his 8, yes 8, children and his wife is a pediatric nurse.
Personally, I would find another dentist. If anyone told me to hold my daughter down to get her to cooperate I would run away from that person screaming. Of course, that is not considering an emergency. You're on the right track for reaching out for help on this. Don't give up and DON"T hold her down!

hello just want to say I pray your baby is healthy but never say no to second oppinion your childs health is much to important to give a casual diagnosis as did her doctor.

For my 2 year old daughter got her a step stool and allowed her to start brushing on her own while I brush of course she tried to mock my actions. I then after she says she's finished, in a playful voice say to her, "let mommy see those pretty teeth oh no you missed someting let mommy help you(you have to be smiling so that she isn't afraid of me hurting her)" now morning after morning night after night she ask me can she brush her teeth it works for us hope it helps you

p/t stay at home mom= P/TSAHM

I have a two year old boy that absolutely loves spiderman. So my husband and I bought him a spiderman toothbrush. My husband also brushes his teeth while "Mikey" brushes his. At the end of the brushing, I usually or my husband asks "Mikey" if we can finish getting the bugs out. We've recently told "Mikey" that if he does not brush his teeth and get those bugs out that his teeth will hurt real bad. And no one wants bugs in their mouth. My husband and I try to make the situation as convenient for "Mikey" as possible. As far as lying her on the floor. I know you did not come up with that idea and the dentist did but I would not suggest it just because it isn't safe hence the choking not being able to breath situation that you ran into. I would suggest taking your daughter to the store and letting her choose what kind of tooth brush she wants to get that way it is always something to look forward to when she does do it. Hopefully my advice helps. Like I said though, I understand that mine and yours two year old cannot brush their own teeth healthily by themselves, so try to make it as pleasant for them as possible and as for your dentist/doctor, I don't consider holding them down on the floor a very bright idea. And I know you were just doing as the doctor said, but I promise other methods of convincing a 2 year old to do something is alot healthier and safer for your child.
Good Luck!!
W.

Yikes!
That does sound scary. My daughter turned blue once when she choked on liquid Claritin. She worked it out before paramedics came, but it was freaky.
If she was laying on her back, maybe she choked on some toothpaste or water dripping down her throat?

On the breath-holding, the only thing I can think of is related more to fainting than to breathing. It's a heart rhythm condition called Long-Q-T syndrome. It would show up on an ECG.

Also, you might ask your pediatrician to consult with other docs in his practice to see if they've had other patients that do what your daughter is doing. Of course, you'll probably get a good response on this site!

As far as teeth brushing, I think the key is to give her some control and not make it a big deal. My daughter (now 3) has been happily brushing her teeth for a couple years now. Here's was we've done, in case any of it helps:
She chose her own (winnie-the-pooh) toothpaste at the store. And chooses which brush to use each time(somehow we ended up with 3). In the morning she does it all by herself; in the evening we take turns. She takes her turn first, then mommy. Your goal should be habit, not technique.
When it's my turn, I use silly tactics to get her to open wide and "tickle" her back teeth.

Whatever you try next though, I'd wait a few days before doing it again. Sounds like she is pretty upset about the whole experience.

Good luck!

I have heard of kids doing this when they are throwing a fit, or sometimes when they are scared. It is the body's natural fight or flight mechanism. So she was either throwing a fit last night or was scared. I would call your pediatrician for sure. Maybe the dentist will have a brushing technique that is more catered to her personalilty. Good luck, I'm sure you were scared to death!

S.,
That sounds so scary! I don't know what you've tried as far as teeth brushing but here is what worked for us.
I have a 2 1/2 year old daughter who used to hate having her teeth brushed but now loves it.
We have used a sticker chart in the past. We bought a book of a bunch on little stickers - I think it was like 500 or so stickers. We made a monthly chart on the computer - I actually made it in Excel. Every day that she brushed her teeth - she got to put a sticker on the chart. We let her help put the toothpaste on it and then we would brush her teeth first and then let her brush them. She also loves to learn Spanish (thanks to Dora and Diego) and so we would count to 20 in Spanish when we brushed and then count to 10 in English while she did it.
She liked having partial control of the toothpaste and being able to brush herself and then she LOVED putting the sticker on the chart.
Hope this helps! Good luck and let me know if you have any questions.
D.

From what I understand this can be normal for children of this age. My neice, will have fits where she doesn't breate and sometimes passes out. I know it can be frightening, but her pediatrician has told my SIL not to worry. I'm curious what your dentist tells you. If you have time can you email me and let me know.

Also, my son is not to keen on teeth brushing so I let him brush them in the morning (and usually chewing on the toothbrush is his version) and then at night I brush them. I sit on the edge of the bathtub with my feet crossed at the ankles. I sit his bottom down in the hole created between my knees. Then I tilt his head back toward my hip and I brush his teeth. That is how our dentist showed me to do it. He used to squirm the forst few times but know will just sit there and let me brush.

HTH

W.

OH MY GOODNESS!!! I just saw your question, and I don't have a bit of professional advice. I do have 3 kids and I can tell you that has never happenend to any of mine. I have had to bruch their teeth like you do hers, and we have the mother load of ctying fits. No one has ever lost thier breath for so long they were dizzy and turning blue. I am only emailing to say from one mother to another.......If your doctor doesn't look into this further I would go to another doctor. I have lots of friends with kids, and family, ect....I have never heard of any of thier kids loosing thier breath for this long. I have seen where they gasp for breath real quick like, but not EVER for that long. It really scared me to read your post, and I just wanted to share that with you incase you felt being pushy with your doctor was rude. Be firm, and require them to find out why this happens to your daughter!!!!!!!

As far as brushing her teeth in a different way, I can see where lieing them on thier back could cause them to choke on all the toothpast in thier mouth. I wish I could show you a picture of how I have brushed my toddlers teeth when they have been unwilling to hold still...I will try to explain....I grab thier chin and have them stand a long a wall so they can't step backwards. I hold a wash cloth in my hand between thier face and my hand. I sorta squeeze thier jaw just enough to force them to open up, but not so hard it hurts. Then I just brush fast, and let the toothpast run down thier chin into my hand and the wash cloth. I pull the brush out and let them spit out the toothpast about half way through. They do hate it, but it has never made them choke. I think standing up, or sitting is safer than laying on thier backs.
I hope your little girl is ok, and that her doctor is right. I just would get a second opinion to be sure.

We had similar problems with our daughter (also 2 1/2) as far as crying when we would brush her teeth. It was a battle every night. I decided to get creative one night and told her she had big crocodile teeth and to open wide so i could clean them. Then I sang her some dorky song involving crocs and teeth. I'm not sure if it was the distraction or what but now as long as we sing to her and pick an animal she's fine. Also, we tell her she can brush her own teeth when we're done if she holds still and cooperates. I bought a toothbrush (.99 at walmart) that when you press the end of it it lights up so that they know how long you have to brush for. That distracts her too.
I hope this helps. you never know, right?

I just wanted to say I'm really sorry...I can't imagine how scared you were. I don't have any similar experiences with this and I would definitely check into it b/c it doesn't seem normal. Don't hesitate to get a second opinion either. As far as brushing her teeth...I have a 2 1/2 yr old boy who can be quite stubborn too. He always wants to put the toothpaste on himself and brush his own teeth, so we make a deal that he can do it, but only after we do it first. We either sing his ABCs or another song, and he knows when we're thru singing that its over. I would suggest trying to give her some control over the situation...whatever you think would fit her personality...then she might be more cooperative. Best of luck...I'd be really curious to know about the breathing thing. N.

Who is your dentist? I want to make sure I dont go there. I would never pin my child down (due in July) and force anything on her. There have to be other alternatives.
Also, maybe she is breathing through her mouth and not her nose - it may be a medical thing. You should check with your pediatrician.

You need to find a new dentist!! And please stop doing this to your daughter. I am appalled that your dentist recommended this method.

I am an RN and I will tell you what it sounds like to me. It sounds like your daughter might have aspirated on her own saliva/toothpaste mixture. It is NOT safe for you to brush her teeth in this position.
While in the lying down position if she does not swallow appropriately it can and will lead to aspiration (breathing fluid into the lungs).

Also, this cannot be healthy for her psychologically. You don't want your baby to associate dental hygeine with being wrestled to the ground.

I don't know if you have tried making this a fun time. Take her to the store and let her choose a fun toothbrush and let her choose the kids toothpaste she would most like to use. And then maybe sing a song while she brushes her teeth. Maybe the song could say how "big girls" love to brush their teeth or some other positive reinforcement. OR have you tried a reward system?? You could make a chart with all the days of the week and then place a sticker under each day for each day she brushes her teeth. And then at the end of the week she could get a treat like a small toy or a trip to the park or whatever she likes to do.

Also, checkout askdrsears.com. This is a good resource for pediatric questions that will offer a more gentle approach.

Good Luck,
M.

It sounds like the whole experience of brushing her teeth is frightning to her. I have a 2 1/2 year old as well & as with any objective, be it brushing their teeth,potty training or even cleaning their room, you have to make it a fun experience. When I need my son to brush his teeth I brush mine at the same time. He mimics what I do & enjoys doing it. After he's done I'll praise him, we might do a little dance, whatever. Just make sure she's having fun with it. Hope this helps!!! D.

That sounds very scary, I'm sorry that happened.

I have a 2.5yo so I REALLY understand this age and power struggles over toothbrushing. I don't think forcing this is the way to go. Sometimes it takes me 15-20 minutes to get my 2.5yo to cooperate, but she always does eventually.

In the morning I have her brush her own teeth while still strapped to her high chair and I sing songs and dance for her as long as she's brushing. If she stops, I stop.

At night, she gets an assisted brushing, in her high chair and she doesn't like that part. But, my husband and I work together to distract her to the point of hardly noticing. I have a stach of toys that the ONLY time she can play with them is while she is cooperating with toothbrushing. Her favorite is a necklace. The idea is to keep both her hands occupied and her mind on something enjoyable while we do a really good job brushing for her.

The more you force, the more she will be scared and resist. You could be creating a lifelong hate of toothbrushing with this method your dentist recommended and that will do more harm than good.

You might start small and give the child TOTAL control back over her own mouth. Encourage her to brush her own teeth and when she makes ANY attempt, reward it. If you wouldn't mind, I'd like the name of the dentist that gave you that bad advice, so I don't take my children there.

We currently go to Dr. Titensors and they've never recommended anything like what you described. Just positive and encouraging the child to do as much for themselves and us to do one good brushing a day.

Hi S.

My son will occasionally do as your daughter did....if he starts to cry really hard, he won't take a breath and then will turn blue and pass out. As soon as he passes out, he comes to and then it takes five minutes or so for him to return to normal.

I have read and been told that little ones will do this and that it is "normal"---even as terrifying as it is for us parents!

I would definately do as you said and try to find an alternative to the way you were brushing her teeth. I don't know if you've tried any positive reinforcement backed up with books about toothbrushing or dvd's about toothbrushing. If she has a favorite doll or stuffed animal, have her brush their teeth so that she feels in control of it.

I remember my daughter at that age (she's now 5 1/2)was very independent and didn't want anything forced on her, so if you can find a way to make the tooth brushing seem like she is in control and it is her decision, it will help.

Hang in there....being a mommy is the hardest job I've ever held; but as my children are growing, the little rewards are worth the struggle.

Hugs,
H.

This is a scarey situation but if you "give in" and show them that it scared you and you give them extra attention, it will just escalate. My daughter started doing this at 12 months old. She would cry so hard that she held her breath and would pass out and twice she had convulsions. the doctor said it was basically that she had a bad temper and that is how she dealt with it and yes it scared her but she kept doing it until she realized that i was not going to be there when she fell. I made sure she was not going to hurt herself and i would talk her through it telling her that she was going to fall and eventually she started catching herself on something so she "eased" herself down. Blowing in the face can work but i would also spritz water in her face and that finally stopped her from doing it. Once she realized that it was not getting her the attention she wanted, she stopped. I know it may sound mean and you have to do what is best for you but if you don't want repeats everyday, don't play into it.

Once when we were at target, my husband was letting her run around and when he got tired, he put her in the cart and she had a fit then she had a siezure in the cart from the fit. She was fine and she was calm after because it really scared her.