Problem My Kid, the Teacher, or Both?

Legally there has to be a teacher child ratio, otherwise it isn't safe for the kids. I would call someone at the DOE and ask some questions and find out how to get soemone in that room to help. If it is a safety issue the will jump to get an aid in the room but they usually need to be pushed.

Just a link for extra info on WI 4k programs - http://dpi.wi.gov/fscp/pdf/4kbul08.pdf
Question 31-32 answer the teacher student ratio issue - there are suggested guidelines but it is up to individual districts.

Problem is both. You daughter is old enough to follow directions and sit still for short periods of time. The teacher is not showing enough positive attention AND is out numbered. With that age group there needs to be at least one other adult/teacher. Additionally, it seems your daughter is bored and needs to be doing more than the curriculm they are covering. Also, the teacher should be willing to allow what the therapist is suggesting. If she isn't, you should have a conference w/ her and the principal/director.

Sounds like a personality conflict. I'm sorry to say it, but I don't think the teacher likes your daughter. I know the teacher has her hands full trying to keep a bunch of kindergartners in line, but some teachers do expect little soldiers........ and really, do you want your daughter to be a little soldier? I doubt it.

Go to the principal and see if you can get your daughter into a different classroom with a more flexible teacher. It may make all the difference in the world.

Speaking as a preschool teacher:

the therapist's ideas will work, but only if the teacher is willing to implement them. 24 kids to 1 teacher, that's not in ratio. (against the law)the ratio of adults to teacher is 1 adult to 25 children 5 and over. If any of the children are under 5, she aged (the teacher) needs to have at least 2 other teachers with her.

it sounds like the teacher is over whelmed and is not actually teaching anymore, she is simply coping. And your daughter is reacting to the stress of the classroom.

As a parent:
talk to the director about your concerns, double check the ratio in your state (on your own, dont depend on them to tell you) and consider placing ur child in a different program if the problems are not resolved.

good luck

my opinion is its both but more the teacher

Ask if your daughter can be transferred to another teacher and class to " start over" if possible. If it is, meet the teacher with your daughter and discuss what behaviors will be expected beforehand. Start with no more than 3 major at a time. Then set up rewards and consequences for these daily and weekly and make sure the rewards and consequences include something at school and at home. Get an email from teacher and give her/him yours or get a notebook for communication daily.

I currently tutor a " challenging" girl and she has responded well to daily stickers ( she loves to choose which ones and to collect them) and weekly incentives as well as the 3-warning system, a timer and a counting system to give her a chance to behave, etc.

If you can't get a new teacher or class, try the same with the old one, but also be SURE to include another administrator from the school in the session if you feel you are not getting anywhere and insist that your child have extension work to challenge her reading levels, etc.

I think it could be a combination of both child and teacher as others have mentioned. Though there is a possiblity there is no legal ratio required, it seems odd that it is only the teacher with the full class of children. When my older kids were in pre-k, there was the main teacher and then a helper. In the public schools here, there is a helper even in kindergarten. It also sounds like you might be better speaking with the teacher and principal in a conference. If she is ignoring your child outside the class even to just say hello, how much attn does she get in the classroom. If your child is in fact bored, how is any "intervention" going to help?

Before I got very far into your situation I already figured your daughter was bored!. When my daughter was 2 weeks into her kindergarten year she had already figured out how to go to the "nurses" office to get out of class. she was super bored. I talked to my daughter about it and just happened to hear from another (room) (since I didn't drive I wasn't at the school to see)mom at the time and found out this teacher had them stting in "circle" time ALOT! There was NO challenge there and the teacher wasn't willing to help at all. I pulled her out of that class with alot of hard work and she THRIVED!!! Wasn't at the nurses office unless it was neccessary!

Never heard of kindergarten for 4-year-olds, who don't turn 5 until half the school year is past? She obviously doesn't still need a preschool class. We know that kindergarten is very important for setting the foundation for necessary skills for further learning. There is a lot of pressure on children these days, and increasingly on very young children. You are right to be concerned.

The teacher's attitude toward your daughter is telling. I want a kindergarten teacher to be warm, caring, and very positive toward the little ones in his/her care. If you are sensing distance, and observing her actively ignoring your child, it sends up a warning flag that this is not the best place for your daughter. Further, your bright little girl is having negative behavior changes due to this setting. I wonder if other students in this class are also misbehaving and receiving sad face reports daily? Could it be the teacher's classroom managment that is lacking?

Since she is not thriving in her current setting, as a parent, you have options. A different class/teacher, a different school if they won't/can't change her (inner-district transfer), or ask to have her tested and perhaps advanced to the next grade.

Take action now! See the principal, parents who are politely pro-active for their children are respected, and often their wishes for their child quickly granted.

Yes, there is a student to teacher ratio in elementary school. Portland Public Schools is strapped for money and yet always has at least one aid in Kindergarten classes. Perhaps Milwaukee doesn't have that rule and if so, I suggest that you try to find a different classroom for her in the private sector or take her out of Kindergarten.

I don't know what 4K means. Is it for the younger children who aren't quite physically/nervous system maturity ready for regular kindergarten? If so, it's even more essential to have at least one aide if not more. Your daughter may just be too young for such a structured classroom.

I also suggest that the teacher is not handling it well. She should be giving your daughter personal attention when your daughter goes up to her at a fun night. The solution for acting out to get attention is to give attention every time it's appropriate while she's behaving. If she wants her to learn not to interrupt she should tell her that and not just ignore her or respond coldly. And.....most importantly the teacher has to be able to provide for each child's individual education needs.

Some children in our public schools are allowed a tactile object; even to chew gum or go out in the hall for a quick snack. My granddaughter had difficulty sitting in one spot during carpet time and her teacher had her sit in a chair. That worked! When I was in the classroom for Grandparent's Day, the class lined up and stood to sing a song. My granddaughter had one knee on a chair. The teacher said that as long as my granddaughter had a chair as an anchor she stayed in one place.

I see this as a not good fit. Your daughter needs some accommodation and the teacher isn't able to give it to her.

You could try having an evaluation thru the school district in an effort to get an Individual Education Plan or a 504. Federal law requires that all school districts provide such an evaluation and make what accommodations they can to assist in learning. Having the teacher say that she's disruptive should be cause enough to get an evaluation.

My granddaughter, in 4th grade, did get an evaluation because she was not only disruptive but having difficulty with reading and handwriting. She was diagnosed with ADHD and was given extra tutoring in reading and writing. She also began taking medication She had ADHD type symptoms in Kindergarten but everyone wanted to wait to see how she developed.

Her second grade teacher wanted an evaluation but my daughter balked at the idea. I wish that my granddaughter had gotten help early on so that she would be further along now. She's in the fifth grade this year and having her first successful experience in school.

Her kindergarten teacher was an excellent teacher. Without that strong beginning I suspect my granddaughter would still be having difficulty. My daughter and I have learned much about the educational system and how it can help kids having learning difficulties and it's limits. I strongly urge you to find a way to resolve this issue with the school so that your daughter has a positive experience. The first year can set the tone for the years to follow.

At least the teacher needs to be more understanding and be willing to accept suggestions from trained people such as the therapist you consulted with. Having a tactile ball is a very reasonable request. I could be like the chair that helped my granddaughter.

Perhaps the therapist can work with the school district to get this to happen. Call the school district's main number and ask to speak to the office handling student evaluations for learning disabilities. Not being able to focus and fit in in a classroom can be labeled a learning disability. They may decide she doesn't have one but then again they may be able to help you get the help that your daughter needs.

The office in my area that does this is called the Multnomah Intermediate Education Service District. Multnomah is our county.

I quickly looked on the WI Dept of Public Instruction, and I couldn't find anything about student-to-teacher ratios. Here's the link: http://dpi.wi.gov/home.html

My opinion is that the teacher is outnumbered and overwhelmed, and that your daughter is most likely bored. My son has always acted out when he's been bored, which has been remedied after bringing that to the teacher's attention. However, 25 kids to 1 teacher is way too many. That needs to be addressed.

If you can't find the information you are looking for on the DPI website, please contact them directly. You could perhaps look into open enrollment into another district, which opens in February (you'll find info about that on the website as well). However, you need to know that if you do that, you are responsible for the transportation, bussing is not available. There are also many charter schools in the Milwaukee area you could look into.

Good luck.

Your child is 4 and from your description, very normal in her ability to stay on task. I think the main issue is the huge number of children that age with only one teacher. I have never seen such a ridiculous ratio. If you have no choice but to be in this classroom then here are some suggestions.

Ask the teacher to meet at some point without children present. Start out by acknowledging the huge challenge she has with this classroom and ask what you can do to help (volunteer in the classroom, organize other parents to volunteer, etc). A huge plus for you volunteering in the classroom is you will get a better sense of the teacher's style of classroom rules and discipline which you can then help your daughter understand and practice outside of school.

Then open up a discussion with the teacher...what would she like to know and understand better about your child. With that many kids in the class she may not even realize how much your daughter already knows. Ask if she has a way your daughter can be utilized as a helper for the kids that don't know the letters yet. This has worked well for my son when he ends up in classes where he already knows the material. If the teacher uses him to teach and demonstrate, then he stays interested and he develops new ways of approaching the material in order to help different kids. He has been doing this since K at age 5.

The tricky part is educating this teacher about your daughter's tactile needs. A good teacher recognizes that different kids need different things, but if this teacher is refusing then you have a poor teacher. My son has needed various classroom "aids" over the past couple years including a chew stick, a stretchy band around the legs of his chair, and tactile balls. Having a letter from the therapist usually will help, otherwise go over the teacher's head. If you still have problems, make a written request for a 504 Plan. The school has to follow through with this request.

Good luck. I find that if I stay pleasant, am willing to help solve problems, help in the classroom, etc. that things usually smooth out.

Wow this was us when our son was in Kindergarten. First and foremost your daughter is in preK and it is normal for them to be wiggly. Since you said you are seeing a therapist you can have them write a letter to the school to make sure the teacher uses the tactile ball. Our son was not diagnosed until 4th grade with a touch sensetivity diorder and OCD and that is why he was so unfocused in class. He was also reading in kindergarten and the teacher had no clue what to do with a child like him . When kids can do more than their peers somethimes the teachers feel they do not have to work with them as hard as the kids whom need academic help , and that may be why she is acting out. My suggestion would be get a letter from the therapist and talk to the director or principal of the preschool and they should work with you to help your daughter.Also talk to your daughter about being a big helper in class and maybe you can give her a reward for every day that she is given a good report from the teacher. We have a red ,yellow ,green system at our school. The teacher uses a bingo dauber to put a dot in our daughers planner every day to let us know how her day was green for good,yellow if she needed a warning about too much talking or not listening to instructions ect.. and red for just blatant disregard for classroom rules. Good Luck !

Ask her teacher to try a different approach with her. When she comes in to class, if the teacher would tell her she looks nice, or pretty or some other sincere complement, I bet your daughter will do better on trying to follow directions and such. Sometimes if we get the idea that someone doesn't like us we will act worse for that person, whether it is a teacher, a co worker or even a family member. If the teacher would find ways to give your daughter positive feedback and not so much negative, I bet she would find it is much easier.. if she did that with each child in that class, she might be able to control the class better also. I would also go to the school board and complain (other parents may join you) in not having a helper in the class, 24 kids for one person espeically at 4 years old is too many to handle and every child loses out with it. Maybe there is mothers who can set up a volunteer chart where each mother takes one day a month to be the helper.

Pull her out of this school. Four-year olds (especially boys) aren't physically "wired" to sit still and pay attention. Put her in a regular daycare. Trust me. She' only 4! She won't fall behind or suffer academically.

Are you kidding? 24 kids in a class? What is this school district thinking? This school and teacher obviously don't know enough about preschooler behavior or they wouldn't even be attempting this class. Kids this age shouldn't be forced to learn anything they're not physically wired to learn about. Their brains are still developing. If you force a kid to sit still and learn some topic, that kid is going to learn that he/she "hates" school, hates her teach, and WILL act out. Which is a rotten attitude that can persist throughout their school career.

If you can find a school that will let her read while standing, jumping, or spinning around, go for it. But too many schools are trying to make our 4-year olds act like 2nd-graders (sit still and pay attention) and that's just plain wrong.

Sounds like you do have a catch 22. Sounds like this is at it's critical mass and too much has gone on. Your teacher is burned out because she's paid well one of the worst wages in America for a career you need a degree for and she has over 20 other students to bother with and she has to bother disciplining yours as well so why bother at this point? She is done with your daughter sounds like to me.

I'd talk to the teacher, guidance counselor, principle. . . But I'd pry do this and very quickly. That way you can demand a new teacher faster and not make this year a complete waste.