Seeking Moms to Give Me Opinion on 4 Year Old Son with Symptoms of Aspergers

My 4 year old grandson has "quirky" behaviors too and likes to play by himself but he has been in preschool for 2 1/2 years, has an adult "helper", goes to speech therapy (to help with spontaneous speech, loves swimming, can read, loves flags and signs, and music.
His socialization has improved so much in the past year or so, and he is potty-trained.
He does not have Aspberger's but has been diagnosed as high-function autistic.
So, if I were you, I would have him evaluated and see if he is eligible for the services that are available.

A.,

What you describe sounds like classic Asperger. It does not go away, and it does not matter if he tests a few points off the special needs class, he still needs all the therapy you can get him as early as you can get it. He probably needs the speech, OT, social skills training, and psychiatric care and will required more and less of these services until he reaches true adulthood, which may not be until he reaches his mid twenties. He will likely need to be followed by a psychiatrist and a therapist for cognitive therapy and medication management well into adulthood. This is not a bad thing, the therapy is effective, but is hard work and small baby steps.

Asperger is by definition a high functioning disorder. He will need help in school, but you will always be right on the border line because he will have at least average intelligence. Even if he always qualifies for services in school, the school is only required to make him functional in the classroom setting, they are not obligated to maximize his potential, which is what you will want for him. You will always need as much private speech, OT, social skills training and medical care as you can possibly afford to give him. It is the best investment you can make right now. Remember too that although the school district will be required to evaluate your son, you should never depend on them to tell you everything you need to know about his disorder, you should own your own evaluation, one that you control, one that you can use to check their accuracy, and one that you use to help him reach is maximum potential in every area you can.

If he does not have a formal diagnosis, take him to a developmental pediatrician, who you can find in at your nearest children's hospital. These are the very best bet for your son, they will coordinate a full evaluation that includes all the different professionals your son will need, and they will put it all in one report that gives you a blue print for his complete treatment plan. I highly recommend that you do this as soon as possible.

Time is free, and you still have some to help him. Get him back into as much therapy as you can, do all the homework they give you, get a medical treatment plan from a qualified developmentalist (the developmental pediatrician can manage his medical needs, but once you have the full diagnosis, so can a board certified child psychiatrist) and don't be afraid to treat the symptoms that you see. Medication can be a tool that helps him manage many of the symptoms (anxiety is likely the cause of his echolalia- saying "I'm a good boy" so often) some symptoms can be treated very effectively with medication. If it works, go with it, if it doesn't, you have lost nothing. We have two children on the spectrum, and medication is very effective for one child, but less so for the other. The key is that medication is only a tool, it should never be the only line of treatment, he should always be in multiple forms of therapy too.

If you need help navigating the school system, look for an advocate. That is what I do, I help parents get the best possible services for their children in school. Read, read, read! Tony Atwood has the gold standard for books on Asperger, and Dr. Mel Levine has some of the best books on differences you will ever read. For school related issues, turn to www.wrighslaw.com.

Good luck. They are a challange, but you can do it. You can email me if you need help, or to cry, or to just vent.

M.

Dear A. H
Before you take him to the Dr and put him on perscription drugs, I suggest that you take him to a chiropractor that deals in nutrician (at least 8 years experience). Your son might be lacking something or allergic to something. I read a book where people were doing strange things (out of character) and when they determined they were allergic to certain foods, the symtoms went away. I would rule out things naturally before anything else. L. J

I have a 17 year old son with Asperger's who used to be a lot like your son when he was that age. Asperger's kids are often gifted, and that can make them appear to not need interventions when they do. I would have the school re-evaluate him, as well as seeking a medical diagnosis. If your pediatrician does not know where to refer you, please look here: http://www.iidc.indiana.edu/irca/fdiagnosis.html for a list of suggestions. (I am assuming you are still in Jsaper, IN). Our son was misdiagnosed until he was 11 years old. I wish I had known that the things we thought were quirks were really signs of autism. Good luck!

Yes he sounds like it and start with the re-eval right away. I have been going back and forth with help me grow and cps on the testing for my son. I have a cousin with aspergers and my son has apraxia. We finally got them to schedule the IEP meeting for the 28th. We are already 24 days past the time allowed for completion. I this last week has been pure hell. I am sick to my stomach and have had a headache now for two weeks straight because of all the agrivation and frustration. Good Luck to you.

I wish I had time to respond. My son is on the autism spectrum and what you have described sounds like him. We have done many therapies and worked with neurologists, speech and language therapists, behavioral psychologists, and social group psychologists. I would start with a neurologist. That's where we started. He was 3 when we started and he is now 11. Martha R. is right on.

If you suspect anything, just call your local public school and ask who to talk with in the Early Childhood Development program. It's all free so you might as well call (it picks up where First Steps leaves off, ages 3-5). They'll do an evalutation/assessment of your son and maybe find an answer - or at least a reassurance that he's within typical ranges at this time. If he needs therapy it's all free. He may qualify for the preschool program in the public schools for the ECD children.

My son just turned 7. Our pediatrician told us last spring that he has ADHD and many Asperger's traits. We have requested an evaulation through the schools and should have an answer one way or the other in the next few weeks. (could do it ourselves but going to a neuropsych costs about $2 out-of-pocket!). Needless to say, I've been doing ALOT of research about Asperger's and other similiar things.

I would ask about high functioning Autism because you mentioned language/speech issues. Asperger kids tend to have very big vocabularies that are years ahead of their peers. They also tend to have very high IQs.

First - do not trust any doc that gives an Asperger's diagnosis before age 6 or 7. It's rare. Many preschoolers have Asperger-like traits simply because they haven't matured yet. Most docs do not want to label a child with it that early because in most cases it will be wrong (something like 75% of preschoolers could be diagnosed using the current criteria!). It's usually obvious a kid has Asperger's when they start school because of the way they behave around other typical 6-8 year olds. Trouble keeping friends, difficulty understanding the silent unspoken social rules regarding conversational turn-giving, monopolizing every conversation so it's about them, talking too loud (or too soft) all the time, excelling in school (high IQ) and often placed in the gifted & talented programs... these are all very typical traits.

The example you give of interrupting and wanting something >now< while you're working -- that's so normal for any 4 year old. They HATE to wait. As for holding the pencil - again that's normal. When my son was in kindergarten, most of the kids in the class needed reminders on how to hold the pencil correctly until half-way through the year. Most kids do not have the fine motor skills to do it correctly everytime until age 6 or 7 or even 8! (best thing to help with handwriting is playing with play-doh, btw - strengthens the fingers).

Because he's sensitive to sounds, he could have something like sensory integration disorder but again, many 4 year olds are sensitive to loud noises. And many preschoolers are obsessed with one thing for a few months and then move on to something else. And many 4-5 year olds love playing by themselves. My 4 year old spends hours by herself in her room in her own little make-believe world - she just has a great imagination. But she also loves playing with friends at preschool or when they come over. When I was a kid I prefered to be myself... my sister hated it and had to be with someone -- just depends on how the kid is wired but doesn't mean Asperger's. A child with Asperger's can be outgoing and like talking with people but once they start talking just don't understand the rules of conversation and it's awkward.

My advice is to request an evaluation and don't stress too much until you get the results.

I think you are dead on with your instincts. My son jsut turned 9 and was never your typical child. He has always been sensitive to noise, clothes, touch, etc. He has always been above average with school and has always been just inept socially. I suspected Asperger's a year and a half ago when I talked to an adult who has it that I went to college with. I suggest you do what most people are telling you and get him tested and get him into therapy again. My son is in one to one therapy because the testing he had before that was inconclusive. You know your child better than anyone and sometimes you have to SEE the child to know how truly different he is. Do NOT listen to people who say all kids are sensitive or obsessed with toys or won't play with others that is B.S. You know in your heart when something is not right with your child. My son tells me his brain is different but in a good way. I think he means his fantastic memory and his high IQ(140 at this point). You take the good with the bad and accept the whole child. My son is a challenge and I just want him to be a happy healthy productive adult:)

L. Etta, mother to a 9 yr old son and a 7 year old daughter

First and for most I wanted to say you are a great mom, noticing some of the strange behavior and asking questions is awesome on your part. Many parents check it off and say they are fine or ignore things like this. So way to go! Thankfully we have one of the best Children's Hospital in the world and they have some of the best behavior therapist there. Get him evaluated by a specialist your mother intuition is always the best, you are around him more than anyone pediatricians don't always see what you see. So get him evaluated at least for piece of mind if nothing else. You may want to put him on a gluten free diet it does wonders for children with aspergers and autism. Please keep us informed on your findings as it may help others and good luck to you and your son.

Hi A.,

There are lots of avenues you can take to help your child, Dr. Cheryl of Integrated Wellcare is great with kids on the spectrum and there is also Dr. DeMio with offices in Seven Hills and Columbus. A great book to start with is: http://www.amazon.com/Disconnected-Kids-Groundbreaking-Ne... It can help you diagnose whether or not your son has a left or right brain imbalance and gives exercises to help work the part of the brain that needs to catch up. It sounds like your son would be able to try these things and it can really help! Good Luck!

If you are in the Greater Cincinnati area, Children's Hospital has a wonderful Autism Spectrum Disorder clinic. Take him there for an evaluation. If you are not in the Cincinnati area, talk to your pediatrician ASAP. Don't let them talk you out of having him evaluated. I think your instincts as a mother are dead on. Best of luck to you.

My son at age 2 1/2 could line up 36 of his lil race cars in a row... the same cars in a color pattern every single time. I couldn't believe he could remember something like that. If he walked out of the room and you switched two cars or removed one... He would walk back in and immidiately notice and look to fix it. My son doesn't speak but has alot of the same tendencies. My son is now 5 and has been diagnosed with autism. Noone ever has told me a specific kind though

your title says it all - symptoms of aspergers. Or it might be regular autism. You need to have him evaluated again......

I have an asperger child, it has taken 7 years to get the diagnosis on this. Just got it in July of this year. There are verying degrees of asperger as there are verying degrees of autism itself.
We had obsessions with trains, then it was cars, he still fixates on dinosaurs, we had Bionacles, dragons, knights kingdom, and we still revert to transformers and Star Wars periodically. Yes, he takes them to the tub. He has poor social skills and while he enjoys other children some he prefers to play by himself most of the time.
I am wondering if it is asperger or a different level of autism. His symptoms are more like those of the neighbor boy who is autistic and not asperger.
I would definately return to professional testing. I don't see that therapy helps very much unless they have a diagnosis to work with. We have been back in therapy since last March and going to therapy without a dianosis and clear plan of action seems to be a waste of time and money to me, and I have experienced this situation. I feel more confident now that we have a diagnosis to work with so we have a plan. Get pushy and get the necessary testing done!!!
We did therapy from age 4 until age 8 with verius types of treament plans but since what we were treating was never clearly marked we really didn't make much headway. Back to therapy at 10 to keep him in school (he turned 11 in April) with no real progress. I am hoping now to get on the correct path with him!

Wow- reading your post made me flash back to many years ago when we went through the same thing with our son (now 7 and in second grade). All of the things you described are things that I have said at one time or another to describe our son. Our son was diagnosed at age 1 with Sensory Processing Disorder and received services through first steps. He did not qualify for special services in preschool, and although he enjoyed kindergarten, he struggled a bit socially. By 1st grade, the school agreed to assess him and their assessment was that he "Likely" has Aspergers. Since this is not a primary diagnosis itself, to get the special services the paperwork states that he has an "Autism Spectrum Disorder" and is now classified for Special Education services. Although it was HEARTBREAKING to hear all of this, we could not deny that our son needed some hlep. He received services all through first grade and he thrived. He is currently in the evaluation process by a private psychologist to confirm a solid medical diagnosis, but he is entering 2nd grade with services already in place and he is a happy 7 year old. My point is this- it doesn't hurt to get your son assessed. Early intervention is the best thing one can do for a child that needs some extra support. But- as someone said in an earlier post- I wouldn't trust a diagnosis of Aspergers until at least age 6. It is more liekly that he would be diagnosed with sensory issues for the time being. Above all- love your son for the unique and special boy that he is.

Also- we had a WONDERFUL PT that we were connected with through first steps but worked with for 2 years after that. Once our son "aged out" of First Steps services, this PT began a PT group at her clinic to continue services with kids but also to be able to make it cost effective for families. He name is Judy Chowdry and her clinic is Advanced Childrens Therapy. She was just incredible.

This sounds exactly like my son, he was diagnosed with ADHD and Aspergers. He is 7 now, diagnosed when he was 3 with ADHD (I know this sounds young, but he has very severe ADHD) and at 5 with Aspergers Syndrome. He is hyper-sensitive to sound and touch, won't hold hands or get close to people, other than myself and my parents. It is very normal for children with ADHD and/or Aspergers to get obsessed with certain objects and sounds, i.e. repeating phrases and such as it calms them. My son excels at reading, reading books 2-3 levels higher than his class, he is currently in 2nd grade. However he struggles with math and numbers. I have worked very closely with his teachers and the school administrators b/c he doesn't qualify for extra help. Every morning he plays the Wii before school, I know this sounds weird, but it seems to help his over-stimulation as well as get out a lot of energy. It also helps with following directions, hand-eye coordination, etc... If you have any questions let me know!

You are right on track to be concerned. I'm glad you're reaching out. Sign on to some autism/asperger/autism spectrum disorder or sensory integration dysfunction (b/c of the sound sensitivity) Yahoo groups for tons of information and support for starters.

Some of the behaviors he could grow out of with time--especially with lots of help.

Therapy sounds like it would be extremely helpful. Check out this site for an idea. suggesting.http://www.abcpediatrictherapy.com/SICamp.htm

Another wonderful place is this if you are in the Cincinnati, Ohio area:
http://www.kidpowertherapyservices.com/

Read, read, read and ask, ask, ask--glean all the information you can. And follow your mothering instincts. A lot of people who have not parented these sorts of children often don't understand because they can seem relatively "normal" or some of the behaviors are within the realm of "normal," but when you add it up these children are dealing with this world in a different way. They need every advantage from the beginning so that they can "normalize" and adapt as they grow. There's plenty of help and hope out there--you just have to dig and look and work and sometimes even fight to get it.

J.

You should go back to have the pediatrician see your son and ask for an evaluation. An evaluation will give you more concrete information, where to start and get him into therapy(if needed). I used to be an occupational therapist and the sooner you can have him evaluated and sooner he receives the help that he needs the better his prognosis will be.

Hi A.,
First of all big hugs to you! Second, trust your instincts. Get him evaluated. The best thing that would come of it is that you would have more information to make decisions about what is best for him. Do not trust your pediatrician completely. Research, research, research, talk with others and listen to your gut. Only you will know what is really right for him.

Last, for you and others on this board, I had to share that I attended a conference last weekend that touched my heart. The NODCC national conference. This is a group of children and adults who all have very autistic type behaviors and usually have been diagnosed along the spectrum of those challenges. All at some point have had an MRI done as part of some other medical investigation and discovered that they are missing either fully or partially part of their brain. It's a piece in the center that connects the two hemispheres allowing them to communicate with them. It was very interesting to learn more about this very special group. They said that may people are misdiagnosed with autism and other challenges so it's hard to tell how common it is. To learn more you can go to their website www.nodcc.org thought I'd post it here in case it might be of help to someone on this message board. Hugs to you all!

Hi! While I know nothing about aspergers, I can tell you that some of these things, just in reading them, sound absolutely normal to me. It is not at all unusual for a 4 year old to prefer playing alone. Especially if your child is wired for independance. That in and of itself is not socially awkward; it's just a stage of development. Some kids are naturally social butterflies, and some kids prefer to discover the world on their own. Both of my kids were "loners" in preschool. They are now 6 and 8 and all about playing with friends. But, because they are so independant, I've noticed already that they are leaders and so far (knock on wood...)are not prone to peer pressure.
It is also not unusal for a 4 year old child to be so obsessed with something that they want it to be with them (literally!) at all times. Even in the shower. lol! My son used to be so obsessed with Bob the Builder he was NEVER without a Bob the Builder toy of some sort. It was as if there were no other toys in the world. lol! He outgrew that phase, and, honestly, I kind of miss it. My son, at 4, also had to be reminded of how to use a pencil everytime. However, he only required 3 months of occupational therapy before entering kindergarten and hasn't had a problem since. It sounds like your son's difficulties are much more severe.
As for the other sensitivities, I don't know. But I do want to encourage you by reaching out and telling you that some of these behaviors are absolutely normal for a 4 year old boy, aspergers or not. God bless you and your precious little boy!

Hi,
Has he seen a developmental pediatrician?
I would take him just for your peace of mind and if there is a mild diagnosis - it would probably help him get services and/or education plans that he needs to best suit his learning style/needs.
Good luck!
T.

For the most part these things sound like normal 2-5 year old behaviors. Kids do have favorite things they like to play with. They are demanding when they want Mom's attention and she is on the phone or computer. Many are not yet ready for interactive play with others; many times kids this age play with their toys and may sit together and pla with the same kinds of toys, but do not interact with the other kids playing.
Make sure your pediatrician has this info. Make sure you know exactly what is going on at day care, school or when any care givers are with him alone.
Hopefully, he has a father in his life or male figure that is giving him love and attention also.

Hi A.,

My son is going to be 5 in September and he has had developmental issues since before he was 2 years old. Continuous speech, physical and occupational therapy. He doesn't or hasn't been diagnosed with Aspergers, but there are definitely some similarities between my son and what you are describing. I would say most definitely if he has been diagnosed with Aspergers, to keep him in therapy, get a developmental pediatrcian who specializes in children with Aspergers, or any other kind of diagnosis. I know my son goes back and forth with things, and typical behaviors change and then new ones become typical.. so its all part of the growth process I feel, for my son anyway. Change.. as they get older and learn new things, even picking up stuff from kids at school. I would just get him into a really good pediatrician that specializes in behaviors/development.. I go to someone if you want a recommendation, or ask your regular doctor for a referral.
Have a good day!
K.

Dear A.: My son was doing all of this at age 31/2. He is 11 now, grade accelerated (gifted) and is Aspergers. A local neuropsychologist diagnosed him at age 31/2. You need to approach the school with your own findings from a neuropsych. who has done the testing on your son, or get an Independent Educational Evaluation paid for by the school/at public expense. It is not in the interest of the district to identify your son, so you must equip yourself with the knowledge to advocate. Go to Wright's Law website www.wrightslaw.com. Everything you need to know is on that site. Check out the Ohio Dept. of Ed. Office of Exceptional Children's website. Call them for information. A contact name is Rochelle Rensch. She is very helpful and family friendly. She is listed on the ODE website. Good Luck.

I am certianly no expert, however, I have seen this behavior in two children. A woman I cleaned house for had a son who would walk around with his hands over his ears wen we vacuumed, didn't like sirens and had to constently be reminded about smple things, ex, his mom had a list of thing sto do in the bath. Wipe, if neded, flush toilet, wah hands, etc... the same thing with bed time. He would also mumble things under his breath. He is autistic, aspergers. My sister aslo has a son that does other odd things. He doesn't mind the noises, hwever, he is quite empermental and thows a fit whenever e doesnt get his way and has really odd movements, as well as likes to have alone playing time... Also has aspergers. My sister has had her son on a gluten free and dairy is very limited and he is doing much better. She did a lot of research and found that irt actuall helps her son, Doesn't mean it will wrk with everyone. I would check wth the pediatrician again and see what they say.
Good Luck!
J......

You've had some great help from experienced moms below,and you MUST hear about something natural that's made a difference for children with autism, aspergers, ADD/ADHD, developmental delays, etc. I'm not talking about 'curing', but offering a lot of help and hope for these wonderful children.
Example: I met a mom this past weekend who's son with autism had gone through hundreds of hours of therapy etc, but was still non-verbal and not improving. Within 5 days of this approach, he began speaking!! Spoke his address, name, and other things that he'd been taught previously, but wasn't able to connect the dots. If that isn't hope, I don't know what is!!
PM me with info for us to talk on the phone so you can at least have more information as you travel along this journey with your little guy...my son is also 4, I'm sure this isn't easy.