Vacation with Religious Parents & Non Religious Husband

My husband has cyclothymia (which is a mild form of Bipolar II with long periods of "normal"), so I can empathize with you. Is he on medication and is it the right one? We found that the SSRIs that he was given for depression were the worst thing in the world for him. Life has been better since he's been on a mood stabilizer. I hope you have similar relief in your family soon.

Anyway...you are essentially your parents' guests and as such, basic manners dictate that you (and by you I mean he) respect the customs of your hosts. My husband was raised Jewish and really doesn't practice any religion right now. He can't stand Catholicism, and my entire family and I are Catholic. That means that when we go to my parents' house for dinner, he bows his head respectfully when my dad says grace.

He needs to understand that having a mood disorder isn't an excuse for rudeness and that he needs to be tolerant of other people's beliefs. Other people's beliefs are not about him and should be a non-issue for him.

Sometimes with my husband I used to tip-toe around him over things like this but mood disorder or not, he's a grown man and can stand to hear when he's being irrational or a baby about something. To me, it's somewhat disrepectful of me to treat my husband like a child who can't ever be made unhappy. So I stopped pulling punches with him and give it to him straight when he needs to hear that he just has to grow up about something.

It is the HEIGHT of self absorbed rudeness to walk into another mans home and tell him which god to worship. Or not.

Refusing to accept the religious practices of his hosts is on par with the branches of proselytizing religions that (instead of inviting/suggesting/respecting) are demanding, threatening, and screaming.

A strong 2nd here for bringing this up with his counselor and coming to a decision on whether or not he can be respectful (or is going to be anywhere from long suffering, to obnoxious, to insufferablly hateful).

Similarly, I have several bipolar friends, and there are several people I know who IN ADDITION to being controlling/abusive jerks are also bipolar.

It takes about a year to get meds tweaked, but after that, a person is left who they are. Sometimes, they're just not nice people. I hope that's not the case with your husband.

This issue hasn't come up before during family meals?

Your husband has three choices.
1. Either sit quietly while your family says grace
2. Not come to the table until after your family says grace
3. Not go on vacation.

I would tell him that if he is going to be so anal about it, he can sit outside while your parents pray... and you can let him in when they are done. Problem solved.

I am not a religious person at all, and I actually am quite against most organized religions. In my experiences, they have all been so hypocritical, and full of their own self-interest.... but that's not the point... The point is that that is MY belief. I would never dream to try and force my opinion on anyone else. I don't even really talk about it unless someone else brings it up. Especially in their own home... They have the right to practice their religion in their home. Heck, even when people who pray come to MY home, I always allow them to say their prayer over the food... it's not about respecting the religion, it's about respecting the person. If your husband can't show enough respect to your parents to keep his mouth shut about them praying, then he can just wait to join the family until they are done.

*wow, that sounds much meaner than I meant it to sound.. I'm trying to be matter-of-fact about it, not snarky, I promise! It just really irks me when people try to stop someone from doing something just because it's not what they believe. I understand that your husband is having issues dealing with his depression and possible bipolar...

You might try going to his psychologist, and seeing what he has to say about this. I'm sure he would have some suggestions!

It's not about religion, per se, but respecting others' beliefs. So if he can respect the fact that they need to pray before meals, or if he can respect them as people, he'll keep his personal feelings to himself. That's the way that I would frame it. Good luck!

Time to have a conversation with your husband about the need to respect someone's right to do as they please in their own home. Your husband doesn't need to listen to it, believe in it, join in or tune in to it, but he does need to respect the fact that he is a guest in your parents' home.

You don't have the right to ask your parents not to pray in their home. If your husband can't control himself, then ask him to wait in the other room until Grace is finished. If he can't agree to that, then he needs to stay home!

If he starts something, remove him from the situation immediately. Take a walk, go for a drive, whatever. Just don't let him insult your parents in their home. I really can't believe that he would do this- even with a clinical diagnosis. He CAN hold his thoughts for the two minutes it takes to say a prayer before a meal especially considering the fact that you are having a preemptive conversation. If he tells you otherwise, he's simply not being truthful. This isn't being "sprung" on him... he has time to desensitize himself and practice holding his tongue.

This isn't a question of religious beliefs so much as whether or not your husband is capable of respecting your parents. If he can't, that's a really big issue.

I would tell your husband to put on his big boy pants & sit quietly for a minute! this is a respect issue and he should be able to hold his tongue for that long. Considering they are not preaching to him and aren't forcing him to join in, and he is an adult for pete's sake.

Tell him it is great that he is coming but out of respect for your family, he needs to agree ahead of time to just sit & tune out the prayer if it really bothers him that much. Don't mean to sound harsh, I can sympathize believe me! My husband/family situation is kinda similar. I cringe every time I hear my hubby 'accidentally' use God's name in vain, as my family (as well as myself) find it very disrespectful! Good luck, I hope the trip goes well!

It is going to be so hot-that he will think he is in Hell-which could precipitate a prayer or two from his own mouth to God's ears! He sounds super fun-maybe when he exits the RV at a gas station, say in Georgia, you could drive away? This is not a bi-polar thing, this is a 'I'm going to drive a wedge between everything and everyone that you hold dear' thing-our children, your parents, your faith, their faith,etc. This is being mean and vindictive-it's about putting you in the middle to watch you squirm and do everything you can think of just to please him. What is he two? He's using religion as an excuse-even if he hasn't already voiced it-you're afraid it's coming-he's holding you hostage-tell him to pop a pill and snap out of it! He reminds me of my first husband-that marriage lasted 11 yrs-it completely broke me-then the divorce left me completely broke-but I was no longer living in constant crippling fear of what was going to set him off! I never shed one tear-I had done all the crying during the marriage-not afterwards. Wish you the best of luck and peace in your life-hope your husbands stays with the therapy and becomes the loving guy and father you and your children deserve. God bless you.

Your husband has no right to ask your parents not to pray whenever they want to. and your parents have no right to try to force or guilt your husband in to praying with them. I think a candid talk with both parties before the trip is in order. Inform them that if everyone will mind their own business and be respectful of each others beliefs and everything will be fine. I would also throw something in there about you not being a middle man. If they have issues, they can talk to each other directly. If its not important enough for them to address it themselves, it is not worth your time. Its not fair for you to have to be everyones mediator. That would make me crazy too!

Even people who are depressed and bipolar can have manners and respect for others.

He should be able to sit quietly while they pray out of respect for them. If he can't do that, and it's going to cause anxiety for you if you are going to be worrying about it, then I would suggest he not go.

You're going to have to sit him down and explain that to him. As an adult, he should be able to handle this. Prayers before meals is really not that big of a deal.

This is not about religion and praying before meals and visiting your parents, this is about you finding a way to not feel responsible for your husband's behaviors and moods.

My ex is Bipolar II, which means his mood swings are not to manic but to depressive, irritable, and angry. I used to "walk on eggshells" for years before we even had this diagnosis. I still struggle with thinking that what I say or do "sets him off" but really, no one is responsible for any other adult's moods and behaviors, no matter their clinical diagnosis.

If your parents are not fully aware of his Bipolar diagnosis and what that means, I would suggest you having a conversation with them before you arrive for this visit. I would suggest to them some coping strategies that you and they can use in the case of an outburst or other inappropriate behavior from your husband. You are focusing on religion and praying as a trigger, but as I'm sure you know, anything could trigger a mood swing in your husband, you can't foresee or prevent this.

Remember that you DON'T have to fix this, during this visit or any other time. This is his issue, not yours. I hope you are getting counseling to help you deal with this disorder of his, and to work to protect your mental health and to help you learn tactics to help your children with this, also.

My ex-husband sees very good doctors and his current medication is working well to level off his moods. He has seen good counselors and has come to (mostly) admit to his issues and be willing to work on them. It's taken me years to find ways to change my way of communicating, and to ignore some of his words and actions, and to focus on my own life. I divorced him and we live separately and parent our 10 year-old daughter co-operatively. We still love each other, and have a mostly loving relationship, which works well for us and our kids and grandkids. But living separately has been necessary for me to distance myself from his moods.

Your husband is a guest at your parent's home and needs to just keep his views to himself. I do it all the time with my religious in-laws, being non-religious myself.

You are going on vacation in your parents' RV and on your parents land. Their core beliefs involving thanking God for the food that they are about to consume. Your husband is an adult and should be able to respectfully sit silently while the prayer is said. He doesn't have to pray, but he does need to be respectful of them doing so. Your husband's depression and other issues would not excuse him making a scene about this. If he is already aware that prayers will be said before meals and chooses to vacation with your parents, then it's on him to be polite. If your parents were trying to "save" your husband, then it'd be on the to stop their attempts to convert.

Your parents can pray over their food and he can dig into his. That's how we do it at my house. Anyone who wants to pray is welcome to, but those who don't aren't expected to wait for them.

Simple freedom of religion.

It does not matter what religion a person practices as long as he/she respects the other person's point of view.

Not only should your husband respect your parents beliefs but they should respect his. If they wish to pray he can sit quietly and wait to start eating. At the same time they should not try to get him to jion in by holding hands or expecting him to say the prayer also.

Oh boy.
This sounds like it's going to end badly.
I agree that you can't ask your parents not to pray. Your husband shouldn't either. I know you are worried it will set him off, and to an extent he can't help it, but still.
Are you really sure this vacation is a good idea? It really sounds like a recipe for disaster.

Mental or emotional illness is not a license to rude. There is no reason for you to have to walk on egg shells with your own family. Yes, your husband has an illness, and yes there will be some behavior beyond his immediate control. However, that is not a free pass to wreak havoc on your family.

It sounds as if he is aware of his issues and is attempting to fix/manage those issues. Kudos to him for the self awareness and the fortitude to seek help from professionals. Now he just needs to accept responsibility for those issues. They are his to own and rectify. He needs to know his behavior matters and "all is NOT easily forgiven" when he has an episode. Again, it's an illness, I get it, however it is a manageable illness. Regardless of illness he is responsible for his own actions. You should not have to police yourself or your children for fear of setting him off. That's a horrible way to live. Not to mention it is just enabling him to continue having meltdowns because in his mind he knows there are no consequences for it. He can say and do whatever he feels like in the moment and then just use the excuse of his illness to sweep it under the rug. Knowing full well that you and the kids will alter yourselves to fit his needs.

Now you are worrying yourself sick over this vacation because you are afraid of what he might say/do in front of your parents. That is just way to much stress for one person to take if you ask me. It seems you never get to have the down time without worrying about his issues. Honestly dear, you sound like you could just use a break from it all :(

If it were me I would have a conversation with him prior to the trip. Simply state that while you are aware of his issues and support his treatment plans you will not tolerate him having a meltdown in front of your parents.

Remind him that they pray before meals, dad leaves the seat up, Mom talks constantly, etc. Anything that might trigger a negative response from him should be brought to his attention prior to the trip. Remind him that you are already on guard morning, noon and night, at home and are really in need of a RELAXING vacation for you and the kids. If he can not GUARANTEE he is on board with this and will not go off on a tangent on the vacation then he really needs to bow out now and allow you and the children the well deserved break from his reality.

Are your parents aware of his issues or would this all come as quite a shock to them? I would have a conversation with them as well reminding them about your husband's current mental state. Discuss his depression and anxiety issues with them. Include the details of known triggers for him. Of course no one is asking them not to pray before their meals however I'm sure there are other little quirks that may also be triggers for your husband that they could avoid. Meaning if politics set him off ask them NOT to discuss political matters, etc.

Just so you know, we are catholic and pray before all meals as well as bedtime prayers with our girls. However, when we have guests over for dinner we do not insist everyone pray with us. Those that choose to are welcome and those that don't that's no big deal to us either. They just respectfully wait for us to finish and then move on into dinner conversations. Now if we knew ahead of time that a guest (especially a family member) was struggling as your husband seems to be then we would have no problem discreetly saying our blessing as a family in the kitchen prior to calling everyone else to the table for dinner.

Peace and Blessings,
T. B

First, some great advice before me, wise mama's!
Thought I'd throw out a Christian perspective that hasn't been mentioned. One of the main tenets of Christianity it to love one another. You could ask your parents to either pray seperately before the meal, or quietly to themselves at the table, as a way to show love and respect for their son-in-law. They are demonstrating their love for you both (which God asks His followers to do) by not making you both uncomfortable. I honestly think you will have a far greater chance at success by presenting it this way to your parents than by trying to change your husband. If he's as bad as you say I doubt he's going to care much that he's displaying bad manners by being disrespectful to his hosts beliefs.

JB, brilliant!

What she said.

And peace to you Sista!

:)

And JE, your diplomacy is lovely. This is pretty basic stuff. In the US we respect the right of all individuals to practice religion. And we respect the right of all individuals to NOT practice religion. EVEN in-laws!

I'm assuming that he has known for years that your parents are religious and pray at meal time? This isn't something new, is it? Of course not. He needs to control himself. If he can't or won't then he should not go. RV's aren't exactly mansions so ya'll are going to be ontop of each other.

We pray at meal time, every time. I want to give thanks for the food I'm about to eat. If he wants to sit there and not pray then fine but to ask your host to not pray is not acceptable in my book.

I would suggest to talking to his therapist prior to the vacation. Discuss a plan for him, with him, so he understands the expectations. If he doesn't like it, too bad. No one is forcing him to go.

Whew!
How about the simple avoidance technique?

Pray before the meal, then call your husband to the table. He can go right to eating, and skip the prayer.

If there is time to discuss this with his therapist before you go, I would do so. If he cannot be a good guest, then you need to consider other accommodations or he should consider staying home. While my DH is not particularly religious, he will simply bow his head and be respectful during grace. Since he keeps saying he will go, reiterate what you expect. That he will be respectful to your parents who are also the hosts. If he starts to disrespect them (and by extention, you and the kids) what will be your reaction? What will you expect him to do? Leave the room? Go back to the RV and wait? Not join the family for meals? I think you need an advance plan.

I would also ask my parents not to try to sway DH. Not that I think they should be on eggshells, but that they can say, "This is not open for debate" and move on vs trying to get him to see their POV if he's just going to blast them.

At the end of the day, no matter DH's issues, if he can't be respectful of his hosts/in-laws/wife/kids, then he should not go. If he goes, he goes with the understanding that x will happen and his reaction cannot be y. IMO, you have to think is it really just because of the bipolar or is it also his personality? And if it's his personality, is the bipolar an excuse?

Frankly, if you are on eggshells at home, I suggest you also seek counseling for your own well-being.

You should talk to your husband about this issue before you leave. Remind him that your parents pray before meals. Acknowledge his feelings about religion. He has a right to his own view points. But how is it going to be for him when he is there at their table as it is happening? Will be OK with it? Does he expect your parents to not pray when he is around? It could be an issue if he really thinks they should remain quiet in his presence. Make sure he isn't going to get annoyed with a simple dinner prayer, that he should know to expect your parents will be keeping their own rituals. Just make sure there are no surprises so he can start to get himself used to what will happen during your visit. If you talk to him in a supportive way, and let him know you respect he has a right to his viewpoints, I think that will help.

I would suggest you invest in a nice sized tent to take on the trip so your husband and/or you and the kids can have an "alone zone". being in an RV with that many people is going to be nuts if everyone is going to have to be on eggshells! frankly, i would leave hubby at home and go enjoy some time with people you can be yourself around. good luck!

I agree with Marci S. or maybe your parents can pray before they sit down. interesting your hubby thinks all the craziness in this world is due to Christianity. LOL... its due to people who claim to be Christian but have no idea what it really means. My opinion is it is about relationship not religion.

I would worn your parents too if you havent already. Glad he still wants to go!!!

You can't make everyone happy. Take the kids and go on vacation with your parents. Leave your husband at home. Try to do something special with him at a later time. Go with your instincts. These are YOUR parents and YOUR husband. It's not worth either of them being unhappy for this short period of time. No one wins if you try to have them all together in that tight space. Straight talk. Hope this helps.

you need to have the conversation before you all go. You all have your ways and you are not going to change your parents and they can't change him so if there is an understanding going into this trip then no worries. YOur parents shouldn't have to stop praying and being who they are because of your husband. If they are not preachy toward you then obviously they know your boundaries. Your husband needs to respect that or then he needs to stay home. so glad he is getting help. No one can be happy if there is an untreated medical condition. Best wishes and prayers

I have seen a lot of responses saying your hubby needs to respect your parents wishes, well I agree but think your parents also need to respect your hubby's wishes. You are all going together here. Everyone needs respect. Including your hubby. I disagree that he is the only one who has to respect them and tolerate their customs. what about his customs and/or beliefs? I am a Christian, and as a Christian I believe in love one another, tolerance for all, and care for everyone. That means if someone is strongly against my religion, I need to respect that. It doesn't mean I can't debate it with them in a friendly fashion should they want that as well. It does mean that if they don't want that, I still need to respect them and their beliefs. I think it is great you are all going together, and there are ways others mentioned to put some space like a tent, or a cheap hotel room. But I think with communication and respect you can all go and manage this trip without too much incidence. The key is communication here. You need to be clear with hubby and with parents about each other's beliefs and what it means to respect each other's beliefs. If your parents absolutely need to pray, they can do it quietly to themselves, or they can do it before coming to the table. If they say prayers only at the table out loud, your hubby can sit there and eat his food without interrupting their prayers. He does not have to participate and he does not have to take part in it by waiting to eat. He can also wait to come to the table after the prayer. But both parties need to understand and respect the other's beliefs. You said you don't feel you should ask your parents not pray and I agree but you ask them to modify how they do it. Make sure they each know that they can practice their own beliefs and do not need to take part in the other persons. So your parents know they are free to pray with the understanding hubby won't be a part of it. And hubby knows he does not have to participate if they are praying. Your kids depending on their ages may need to be clued in, so that they don't say something like hey Dad your supposed to wait to eat, or your supposed to sit with us during the prayer. Your hubby is a person as much as your parents and deserves to go on the vacation as much as much as them or you and your kids. But you should not have to cater to his disease, however you all need to respect each other and communicate to work together to plan a trip you can all enjoy.

Have you talked to him about this potential issue? I think he would handle it better if he knew it was coming, rather than to be caught off guard.
You must be a VERY strong person. I know someone with a husband EXACTLY like this and there's just no way I could handle it, especially with kids around. We went to a concert with them one night and when we hit bottleneck traffic coming out of the stadium (to be expected of course) he suddenly started screaming and cursing at other drivers, calling people "stupid f-ing yuppies" because they were driving BMWs, etc. I was seriously terrified of him at that moment :(
I hope your husband is not as bad as this guy, for both you and your kids' sake, and I really hope the therapy works for him and that your trip goes well!

If he is so deeply disturbed that he will not be able to tolerate people saying grace in their own homes (many atheists are able to tolerate this without any problems) then I would say there is the potential for EXTREME trouble on this entire trip. Family visits are stressful even for nice normal people. I would encourage him not to go if he can't be tolerant of your parents dinner customs.

If this were me, I would NOT let him go if I knew he could not contain his misguided rage against people for having religious beliefs. You say he "won't be happy". If he just silently "broods", that's OK, but if he's going to attack people, that isn't. My extended family contains extreme fundamentalist Christians. Both my husband and I have issues with their beliefs, but we both respect their "ways" when in their homes. Your husband needs much more work before he can be included. Why expose your parents to his rudeness? IF you still decide to risk it, just lay out the rules. "Sweetie, you KNOW they say grace and believe in God. If you can't handle it PLEASE do not sit at the table with us, I'll bring you a plate later".

Good luck, sounds like a very stressful position for you.

Here's the thing. I think since he is just starting the adventure of counseling and possibly having a serious diagnosis there is no way I'd even be considering this trip right now. Seriously, how hard do you think this is going to be for him. He needs to stay at home or you need to re-think this trip.

His mind is just starting to accept he is mentally ill, a life long illness that medication may help with but it may be a long journey to just find the one med that works best for him.

I think this would be way too hard on him and therefore you and your family.

I would not want to go and have to worry constantly if a blow up was right around the corner.

If you can't afford a hotel then you guys really need to reconsider. Hotels can be found for as little as $35 per night. It would give you privacy and him somewhere to go for alone time and quiet.

In a couple of years he will be more stable mentally and able to deal better with triggers.

Wow. I think you need to talk to each party separately. Does your husband believe in religious freedom or would her prefer to irradiate Christianity? If its the latter, then nothing can fix this. Hopefully he does believe in freedom of religion in which case you need to plead with him to respect this custom and be accommodating and polite. I'm guessing your parents already know his feelings about Christians, either way, this is the time to tell them or remind them that its an off limit topic.

Maybe suggest that he not come to the table until after the prayer. He can stay in the next room, and you can tell him when it's time to come to dinner? I would also forewarn your parents that it might set him off. They might take it upon themselves to pray silently to themselves before they began eating, then it wouldn't offend your husband. I wouldn't suggest or ask that they pray silently, but I would offer to do that if I was in their shoes and I wanted to keep the peace. Especially if I knew there was perhaps a mental illness that could be exacerbated with an issue like this. But the fact that you have warned your husband should be enough to keep him from blowing his top over it. He has plenty of time to come to terms with it. Otherwise tell him that if he doesn't believe he can contain himself, that he can eat in another room/area/outside.