My son is 3 years old and started preschool for the first time a little over a month and a half ago. He has a new brother of about 10 months (an adjustment) and no prior daycare or school experience. He goes to school 2 days a week for a few hours. The class is comprised of about sixteen 3 year olds, 3 of which are boys. There is one teacher and an aide. After the third class, I was told by his teacher they were working on getting him to listen because he was not listening to her and not sitting still during story time, etc, but that it was still early on. I have talked to him at home about listening at school. He seems to understand, but when it comes down to it can’t seem to control his urge not to get excited and sit still and listen. He has continued class regularly, and I usually arrive a little early for pickup to peek in unnoticed on story time or foreign language. Almost every class, he is the kid standing up, rolling around, wandering, not following direction, not listening or responding to the teacher. The teacher handles this by giving them the option to sit still and listen or go to the time out chair outside the circle. He tries to sit still in the circle and listen, but almost every time, he ends up in the chair. Last week, when I picked him up his teacher told me she had sent him to the preschool director's office because he wasn't sitting still/ listening or responding to her, so she put him in the time out chair. She said this time he got overstimulated and upset about having to sit in the chair and pushed something off the table next to him and pulled on a stack of bins, which ended up falling over. She also told me he was the one that was disruptive and causing the other kids to misbehave. She did mention he usually acts this way toward the end of the day when it's time to sit still and could I give any advice as to how to handle him. It’s almost like she had never dealt with an energetic 3 year old boy before. When, I went to get him in the office, the preschool director was in the middle of telling him I wouldn’t be smiling if I were you, which he wasn’t smiling, more of an uncertain look in her direction, and that he had a brain and needed to use it to start listening because you can't go to this preschool if you can't sit still and listen and told him how his teacher never sends kids to the office. She ended by saying she would start checking in on him and if he wasn't listening or sitting still when told, he couldn't go to their preschool anymore. I have also noticed over the last few weeks his behavior at home has become intense and he is often mad or sad, which is concerning. I want to emphasize I am not in any way dismissing my son's behavior or saying he is a perfect angel. I realize teachers have to worry about the well being of the other kids and have bad days too. He is a very active little boy, strong willed, still learning to control his impulses and emotions and can be trying at times (like a lot of 3 year olds). Whenever we are out and about, he is definitely not the child that is out of control and he seems right in line with other active boys his age. He is also extremely smart, outgoing, polite, sweet, loving, sensitive and very in tune with others feelings. He does great at home reading books, listening to stories, playing independently and with other kids and does listen to his parents (most of the time). We aren't perfect parents, but we consider ourselves good ones - attention, positive reinforcement, boundaries, love, etc. However, we have also noticed off and on for months now that when he gets in trouble or reprimanded by any adult, he never shows that it bothers him by crying or such, but instead he will start behaving worse or becoming even more defiant than before, almost like he is retaliating for being punished. We are thinking this is what happened most recently at school. We are getting desperate for help from anyone with experience or expertise. Should we pull him out of this school? It seems that by now they expect him to know how to sit still and listen and respond to the teacher. He does tell me he likes school and wants to listen. Is the school just not the right fit for him? Maybe he just isn't ready for all of this? Then, is his reaction to being reprimanded by any adult something that might be more serious and it wouldn't hurt to have him evaluated? Thanks for any input!
Thanks to everyone who posted their feedback, advice and input. It has been of great comfort to me!
Initially, we did end up pulling our son out of the program for what turned out to be only a one week break. During this time, his teacher contacted us and was upset we had chosen to pull him and wanted to see if we could all do something to make it work. We decided to put him back in the program and give it another chance. As of right now, they are allowing him to sit on the teacher or aide's lap during story time, etc. in an effort to get him in the mindset of sitting and listening without him sitting on the outskirts in time out. It seems he is doing okay with this, but I don't know that he has much opportunity to try to sit and listen on his own as I still feel they fear he won't do it and will act out. My son says he wants to go to school, but he doesn't always seem that happy and he constantly mentions how he is trying really hard to listen and sit all the time. This is still bothersome to me that he brings it up several times per day. At the parent teacher conference the teacher alluded to the fact that we might wait and maybe look into having him evaluated next year. Many people who know my son think he just needs to mature and his behavior is not out of line for a 3 year old. When it comes down to it, though, I will certainly do what I need to do and what is best for my son if it becomes evident this isn't just a phase. At this point, I still feel deep down that the program, while I do believe it is a good one and so is his teacher, that it is simply not the right one for our family or for our son. For now, so long as everything seems to be going fine and my son isn't unhappy or feeling labeled in class as the one who can't sit still and listen, then we have decided to try to ride out the rest of the school year and in the mean time look into other schools/programs that are a little less rigid and structured for the next school year. I realize no school/program is perfect, but it is still very important to me that I do what I can to find the one that is best suited for my family and my son.
I will continue to post updates as I hope my experiences can help others going through a similar situation.
Thanks again to all who posted.
I think you need to shop around for another school, he isnt happy there and if those things were actually said to him by the director that is just ludicrous!
How did you refrain from saying anything to her?
Anyway, I think you should concentrate on reinforcing that he needs to listen, respect, mind his teachers and other adults while you are searching for the new school ;)
.
Gosh, I'm sorry, I would take him out and place him somewhere where he can learn the basics since he hasn't been in this type of setting before. He is only 3, my 3 year old is in preschool but there is only 7 kids in her class and two teachers. This just doesn't seem like it is the right place to be. I am so sorry what was said to your son, that was so out of line, I think I would of had to grab my kid and tell them not to expect us back. Your son is totally normal, don't worry.
Hi EB. You didn't mention how long the duration of the "circle time" actually is. At many of the preschools around here (2 or 3 days a week, for only 2 hrs or so), circle time is only 15 or 20 minutes of the day. The other 1.75 hours is spent on group games, painting/puzzles/dress-up/sand/water tables/etc., snack time, clean-up and and outdoor/gym play. If this is the kind of cirriculum you are dealing with, I think it is reasonable to be teaching your son how to sit and pay attention (without causing disruption) for a 15-min storytime period during circle time.
Have you tried taking him to the library for storytime to see how he behaves when required to sit for 15-20 minutes in a different environment? That might be a good place to help you better understand his behavior. If he isn't able to succeed in a 2nd environment for a short period of time you may want to consider having him screened for a sensory processing issue. If your gut is telling you that something is up with your child (outside the school issues) go get him screened.
That being said, I think the response of the preschool Director was extremely poor. I think you are right -- your son is not the first energetic 3 year old boy that this school has seen. My question would be to the preschool Director: "How did the you/the teachers successfully help previous students who were similar to my son and enable them to succeed?" It's one thing to threaten to expell your son -- but the school should have some sort of plan to help your son succeed prior to reaching that point. If they have an answer that you don't like (or no answer at all!), I would immediately find a new school. Keep on advocating for your wonderful son! Good luck!
Argh!!!! It just infuriates me when I learn how schools are so unwilling to work with children!!!! Your boy is totally normal, and he behaves like a normal kid! Please tell me he is not in Kindercare or any of those massive daycares! The number of children seems to be the issue as well. I was an early-childhood educator for 7 years and I can tell you that 16 kids is a large number for that age group. The most they should have is 12 with two teachers. He is ready to be a big boy, and he should go to school and learn. Time out? "I would not be smiling if I were you?" I say find a school where the teachers are PROFESSIONAL!!!! I'm probably not much of any help because I get upset when I learn teachers are so unwilling to teach!!!! Good luck sweetie and please keep us posted...HUGS!!!!!
At three, my son was still in a preschool setting where I was there at the beginning of class. At age 4 he wasn't ready for the "academic" type of preschool setting so I enrolled him in a play-based preschool where they were outside 50% of the time in all weather (it was located on a nature preserve with a demo farm, apple orchards, raptors, and beehives). He thrived.
Your son is just fine, it is the preschool setting that is not right for him. Sounds like there is too much direction from teachers, too much sitting/instructional time (even if the teachers think singing and doing song actions qualifies for movement time, it isn't in the mind of a truly active kid). If the environment is overstimulating him you might also want to do some reading about sensory processing disorder to see if he would benefit from some sensory focused activities based on his individual needs.
If you want to stay at this school, then spend some time in the classroom with him so you can better understand where the conflicts are and whether there are techniques and word choices you use at home that might get his attention better. That also feels like a poor teacher to student ratio for that age group. At 3, my son was in a class with a ratio of 4kids:1 teacher and at age 4 it was 6 kids:1 teacher.
I think he would do better in day care or a program that has lots more play than this preschool.. The difference is your 3 year old wants to play. He is not ready to sit still for long periods of time.. I will remind you that at this age his natural attention span is about 4 minutes,.. anything longer he has to really want to do that..
Let him be a little boy a little longer.. There is nothing wrong with playing and running around at 3.
Does he listen to books when you read to him? Does he listen if he can sit in your lap and actually look at the book while you read? If he does he is right on scale..
Not every 3 year old is ready for a "classroom" type environment.. It just is not necessary for them to be ready yet..
Did I miss something, or did you say that he was three? Three year olds play, to learn at their age, and if I were three, I think I would be mad and sad if I had foreign laguage time too.
If you need day care, find one that is play based and fun where he can master developmentally appropriate english lagnague skills, social skills, and plenty of positive reinvorcement for things that he can do at his age and skill level. If you don't need day care, he will be ready for kindergarten if you have him at home, read to him, play with him, talk to him all day long about everything and anything, and enrich his everyday enviornment. You will give him a great start and he will learn all the skills he needs if you just include a few regular play dates to socialize.
Nothing he is doing is developmentaly inappropriate. What surprises me is that the other kids can do what this preschool is expecting, which is just freakish and not going to help one of those kids be a genius if they are not going to be a genious anyway. What a waste. I would get my child out of any insistution that though it was in anyway helpful or appropriate to speak to a three year old like he was a little adult. That director has no clue what makes kids tick, and I would not leave my child in a school under her direction for another second.
Find some thing fun, something developementally appropriate, and let him be a success.
M.
Well consider that all the other kids in the class are sitting and listening. He may just be too young for school. Just not ready. Since he is only three you have next year to send him. Then he will be in a prek class.
It does sound as though the administrator was being a little mean. Or expecting to much. How long is the class? Is there any way he could go for less time?
Find another school. I had my son in an in-home daycare and it did NOT work out. The woman decided he was autistic. It was his first time at daycare, and I think he picked up on the fact that she didn't like him. I started my son at a local Kindercare, where the providers understood that he had no daycare experience. They were very patient with him and now he's doing fine. I noticed my son adjusted faster when he was there more often - 3 days or more per week. If you can do that, it'll probably help him as well. Good luck!
Mom, I think you need to consider all of the things going on in your little guys life and the preschool is being pretty hard on him to be honest. He has a new baby at home , lots of changes to get used to in addition to starting preschool, which is a huge thing in itself, with for the first time being away from home and in a structured environment. Self control and the ability to sit and focus does not come easily for young children, especially boys. I was an teacher's assist for 4 yrs to 3 teachers at a time and saw that many 5 yr old boys had trouble with self control and sitting to focus on anything for more than 5 minutes. THis is developmental thing that comes with age and maturity. From what it sounds like the Director did not handle your son's behavior well, using a more positive method of discipline would have been better. ALso, just wondering, how much outside play time is there at this preschool for your son?. Boys this age need at least 30 minutes in morning and again afternoon to let off some of their excess energy. I am a preschool teacher now and have been for 3 yrs and love it. Personally I would visit and look at other preschools in the area where they are more tolerant of young children learning how to behave in a new and structured enviornment. I think you will find a happier son if you do this. Pls keep us posted and good luck .
Sounds like he is a regular boy!! We seem to have the opposite situation in the fact that my son was in daycare until he was 3, I lost my job, took him out of daycare and am now home schooling him. But that sounds just like him, he was almost always the roudy, loud, tough one in the group where ever we went. I read a book "To Train Up a Child" by Michael Pearle and it was the best parenting book I have ever read. Using the training techniques in the book after a short time he would be the one sitting still, listening, following directions. Telling him or talking to him does almost no good. Training is just like practicing. We would take time sitting down while I read, sitting still on the couch with no distractions, no toys, no t.v. to get him in the habbit of sitting still. He learned to be quiet with one time saying it. Standing still. If you feel like it would be better to pull him out, you probably need to. Good luck to you.
I can't imagine being sent to the director's office at 3! I'm an assistant at a preschool and we handle everything ourselves. I'm wondering if maybe their circle time, etc is a little too long...it shouldn't be more than 10 to 15 minutes.
I would probably look for a different preschool. You want his first experiences of school to be really fun and not negative.
Also, our preschool offers 3 days a week or 2 days a week and the kids that are 3 days have an easier time adjusting to school and listening a little better than the ones that are only 2 days a week. If you have that option you may want to try it.
Good luck and I'm sorry all the things are going on for him.
Oh my goodness, you're quality parenting should nor be threatened by a less than perfect nursery school match!
There is no 'rule' that says each and every three yr old boy will be ready to sit and listen by exactly a certain age.
If you think it is worth the wait, keep him in a little longer, may only be a few weeks more before he 'gets' it.
But for now you may be better off with a parent and sibling involvement class like gymnastics or moms day out, etc...
Since he doesn't HAVE to go to school at all, why push it if he seems to hate it?
Your son sounds EXACTLY like mine! My son is now 8 and knowing what I know now about him one of my biggest regrets is that I didn't pull him out of his preschool (it was a Montessori btw, so I figured it was the perfect school). They ALWAYS were sending him to time out for fidgeting and wiggling during carpet/story time, and he would get more defiant- we were constantly having talks with him about his behavior at school- telling him he needed to stop being naughty and listen to his teachers. This continued through Kindergarten where he was always labeled the "naughty" boy and he was becoming angry and defiant. He had an awesome first grade teacher who helped me identify alot of his needs and didn't focus so much on him needing to be the perfect sitting still child. Some kids need to move their bodies and shouldn't be punished for something they can't control. My son is super high energy and needs to be able to release it, sometimes it's as simple as standing at his desk while he takes a test. He is now in second grade and is having a GREAT year- even though he is still a HUGE wiggle worm. He is not a discipline problem and he is at the top of the class academically. Ever since I have shifted my position on trying to tell him to quit being naughty for things he can't control things have gotten so much better. A lot of his truly naughty behavior has disappeared because he feels understood now (that is likely what is going on with your son when you say he gets more defiant when he gets in trouble because that's what my son did). He does listen to authority and he is a great kid. My advice to you based on what I have learned is to be very aware of people who want to put all children in a perfect box and label those who don't fit into that box as "troublemakers", especially if you are a mom of a high energy boy. I'm so thankful for my son's teacher who helped me to learn that lesson while it is still early.
My gut feeling about what you wrote is two-fold: 1) This school may not be a good fit for him and 2) He's actually not spending enough time in school.
Kids need to learn how to act appropriately. I have 2 and 3 year old boys myself and I'd like to add that little boys are NOT like little girls! They need way more activity and have a more difficult time sitting still. This class is almost all girls so of course your son stands out by being more active. Also, he might benefit from spending more time there - 2 or 3 full days. He needs to learn appropriate behavior. I would suggest finding a new school and enrolling him for a greater number of hours.
I am a former teacher, and just maybe he is too young for a group that big. He may just not be used to sharing time with soo many others, thus I would suggest a smaller class, maybe made up of 5-6, rather than 16, which would offer him a tad more structure and more attention. After all he is only 3 years old, still holding on to his toddler days while trying to be a school age child!
So I would either move him to a smaller class, or hold out until he as least 4 and in the meantime you can get him used to larger groups by his participating in diverse activities, led by a chaperone that you know and trust----swimming, gymnastics, tee ball, singing, etc type groups for little guys.
Take him out. Period. I woul dnot tolerate the pre-school director talking to my son that way.
He probably needs a different typ eof learning environment. Try something totally different like Montessori or a nanny share maybe.
Pull him...and read this book. I have 12 years experience in early childhoood education.
Michael Gurian/Kathy Stevens The Minds of Boys
I would find another preschool with a lower teacher-to-student ratio that knows how to work with young children. The preschool director was completely inappropriate when addressing your son. He's 3 - that's what 3 year-old boys do! You'd think with only 3 boys in the class the teacher and aide could handle this. I'm a first grade teacher with 16 boys and 7 girls in my class (no aide). There are ways of dealing with energetic boys without demeaning them.
I would highly recommend a book called "I'm A Keeper" by Ray Lincoln. It teaches you how to discipline your child based on his own temperment. It sounds like you have an SP on your hands. Take a minute to check it out and you will not be sorry guranteed. We have had him speak at our church on this book for a 4 sessions and it changed a lot of ways we parent our children. Some have even started seeing him for counseling and said he is amazing. Sure hope this helps.
Perhaps the ration to student at the pre= school is too high for your son right now. Can you find a program with more one on one attention. Just because a preschool does not work for you and your son does not mean it is a bad one it just means it's not for you. Fortunatly for all of us the education process is filled with lot's of choices. I would consider another program with less ratio. You can check NAEYC for approved programs or you might consider an at home with less numbers. Check with your county for a listing of licensed options.
Updated
This school is not the right fit for him see these articles about the differences between boys and girls and early learning. :)
http://www.earlychildhoodnews.com/earlychildhood/article_...
http://www.earlychildhoodnews.com/earlychildhood/article_...
