Child Lying and Mother Letting Her/divorced Family

I work for a childrens home and have seen a lot of children from different situations. My biggest advice to you is to first try to develop somewhat of a relationship with the ex. The second is to let the child know that as long as she is honest with you the consequences for the things she has done will be for her benefit and not punishment. The child needs to understand that misbehaving at school will have a lifetime of effects on her in all areas of life. But from my experience the biggest make families that have been interrupted by a divorce and remarriage make is the lack of communication. Children will use whatever they can to play adults against one another you are giving her perfect ammunition. Take my advice and at least try to respond civially to her mom. You don't have to agree with her on how she raises the children but by communicating with you keep the wall torn down that build and create problems.

What I immediately notice in your post is that you and your husband are not receiving the same information from her school as her mother is. You have an equal right to be informed, the school should have both your and your husband's contact information on file in addition to hers, and both the mother and the father should receive notice when an incident serious enough to warrant suspension has taken place.

Yes, she should have told you, but more to the point, the school should have as well. I know it has been a struggle for us to make the schools of my step-children understand that they have TWO households, but we have been persistent enough that they have come around and maintain our information on file and we generally get the same letters and emails as the other household.

I say this because you will probably have greater success impressing upon the school that they have a duty to the father as well as the mother than you will convincing the mother that she needs to share the information with you.

If you want to get very strong with her, though, I am willing to bet that the custody agreement has language about mutually making decisions and sharing information about education. She is in violation of that by withholding information.

It sounds to me that the mom is a partner in your step-daughter's conspiracy. Take it from me, it is very tough to convince a child that what they have done is wrong if they are being told or shown by one of their parents that it is okay. By not telling you it happened, mom was signaling to the daughter that it was okay not to tell you. She is also probably encouraging it by saying things such as "you know your dad, he will probably ground you" or something similar. This accomplishes two things. One, it puts her in the hero/rescue role for keeping her daughter's secret and keeping her out of trouble and two, it paints dad as the harsh disciplinarian (even though we all know that some behavior deserves discipline and that fair punishment is not out of line).

So for your questions - Confront the X about not telling you and let her know in no uncertain terms it is absolutely unacceptable (and probably in contempt of the custody order). If you do not do this, she will think she has gotten away with it and will do it again. Most people do not like to be confronted, so don't let her get comfortable by giving her a pass. In my experience, continuing to point out every time you catch someone withholding information is the only way you have a shot at getting her to stop doing it because it's uncomfortable for her and it also tells her that you will always find out. It may take a while, but you WILL find out.

Let the school know that your step-daughter has another household that they have a responsibility to contact. Make an effort to get face time with teachers and the principal so that they know you exist and are interested. I promise if you don't appear at school from time to time and mom does, she will take every opportunity to suggest to teachers, doctors, principals, coaches, etc. that she is the *real* parent that does the *real* work and that they only need speak to her.

The Truth of the Matter
Teaching children the importance of honesty.
By Dr. Henry Cloud & Dr. John Townsend

Q: How do you teach your children the importance of honesty? What discipline or corrective action should you take when you catch a child in a lie?

A: This is one of the most important issues that a parent can worry about. Honesty is one of the bedrocks to success in relationships. Not to mention that our whole spiritual well-being depends on it!

We need to be vigilant about our kids learning to be honest and always deal with dishonesty when we see it. We should also make it easy, comfortable and beneficial for our kids to tell the truth. We should be loving and grace-filled when they tell the truth. For example, if they're honest about doing something bad and we get angry and condemning, they're going to think honesty is not that good of an idea. You can still discipline them for their wrong-doing, but at the same time reward them for being honest. Make sure your kids understand the discipline they're receiving is a lot less because they told the truth than it would have been had they lied. Praise them and thank them for telling the truth.

Three concepts are helpful when helping kids learn about honesty: Teach, model, discipline.

Teach about honesty. Discuss honesty with your kids in the course of normal conversation. Get their thoughts and talk about how hard honesty is sometimes. Talk about why it's hard. Get to their fears of being honest and process what they're afraid of. You might find it has something to do with you or someone else, such as the fear of someone's anger. Also, read books about honesty with stories that show the problems with lying, like Sophie and Sam, one of the children's books from the Boundaries series by Tori Cloud. Also, watch good videos that model and teach about honesty. Memorize Bible verses about honesty, too, and reward them for learning verses.

Model honesty. Kids will always do as you do, so model honesty. Don't make excuses for things, or blame others. Confess when you're wrong. Don't tell someone "white lies" on the phone as your kids are listening. For example, don't tell someone you have plans that night even though you don't but wanted to stay at home and have some time for yourself. Be honest and say that. And NEVER tell your children to tell someone else something that's not true in order to protect yourself. "Tell them I'm not here," when the phone rings is a common example of a lie that you should avoid.

Discipline them for dishonesty. It's important to tell your children they're in trouble because they didn't tell the truth. Make the discipline for dishonesty more significant than what you would do for other common infractions so they understand the significance of being honest. For example, "This consequence is for not telling the truth." Then when the discipline is over, ask them if they know why they were in trouble. Make certain they can say that it was because they didn't tell the truth. Then have your kids say they're sorry, and they won't do it again. Be sure to ask them if they know what will happen if they do it again. Tell them they'll be in trouble if they ever lie. Then forgive them and move on.

Remember, the balance here is grace and truth. Don't make it toxic, but be loving and firm.

Drs. Cloud and Townsend are counselors and the authors of many books—including Raising Great Kids, Boundaries, and Mom Factor—as well as the hosts of the syndicated national radio program "New Life Live." You can experience the wit, wisdom and understanding of Dr. Cloud and Dr. Townsend weekly through the Monday Night Solutions Tape Club. Each week you will receive an exceptional live audio recording by the doctors mailed to your home. Their biblical solutions for relationships and life's challenges will help you invest in the future of those you love, so enroll today! For more information or for a complete list of their extensive resources and speaking engagements, call (800) 676-HOPE or visit their Web site at www.cloudtownsend.com.

Copyright © 2007 by the author or Christianity Today International/MOMSense magazine.
Click here for reprint information on MOMSense.
March/April 2007, Vol. 10, No. 2, Page 13

Ditto everything Erikka said.

Your husband needs to become more involved with the school. He needs to establish a relationship with the staff, the teachers, EVERYONE. He needs to establish his OWN line of communication with the school. Schools are VERY used to dealing with divorced parents.

Take a more active role with the school and you won't be as blindsided by these lies.

L., I would go to the school's website and sign up to be alerted of all of her grades, progress reports, etc when they come out. Many schools do this now. Also, go to her school and explain the 2 households information. Take the divorce decree and child support order with you that explains your husband has joint custody and therefore a right to know all that is going on with his daughters. Ask the school to please notify both parents in the instances of misbehavior, bad grades, accidents that happen on the playground, etc. The school's will do this with some prodding and understanding. Do not rely on the already-proven-to-be-unreliable-ex...go around her and take control of the situation yourself. Good luck!

Your boyfriend doesn't have to depend on his daughter or his ex-wife to keep him informed. He should be able to talk with the school and ask the school to contact him as well for parent teacher conferences/copy of report cards/ and for anything that they would call the mother about. If he has visitation rights, he has rights to that information as well. That alone may make the daughter feel that dad cares and is invovled even if it means she gets away with less.
Who takes care of the sister with cerebal palsy when she's with you? Maybe take some load off of her so she can just be 11 yrs old. If their mom has the worry and care of that daughter 24/7, she may be stressed out as well and just wants to avoid another stressful situation by not informing their father of things that he will just push back on her. At 11, this girl knows right from wrong. She may lie because of things in her life she's unhappy about or things she's angry about or stressed about, but that is NOT an excuse to lie. The daughter needs to be the one held accountable. So if she lies, she needs to be held accountable by her dad. If her mom is telling her to lie, dad needs to talk with mom and tell her that he only wants what's best for their daughter and that he is not going to blame or argue with her (the ex). The mom and dad need to be on the same team when it comes to parenting on issues that affects both households and you need to support that whether you speak to the mom or not.

In my experience with a step-son and an ex, if the mom is encouraging the girl to lie, then there is something major going on. Keep encouraging her to be truthful. Have you considered a counselor? Also, according to Texas state law, at 12 years old, the child can decide what household they want to live at - it does involve court but the age is 12!

We are in the exact same boat. My husbands ex has taught their son (who is 8) to lie and manipulate anyone you have to to get your way and for a long time he seemed he resisted that influence, but now he is lying all the time about things that just don't matter. His mother has recently gotten married to a man she has known for just a short time and my step-sons mom has told him he has to call him dad when my husband plays a very active role in his life. My step-son has been forced to keep everything in his life as far as his mothers home a secret from us. She has been doing that since I know he was 2 years old. He was forced to keep his mother's wedding a secret and their move to a new town. We have done our best to be the bigger person to set a good example for him, but the harder we try the more she manipulates him. My advice is just to set good moral boundaries with your step-daughter and to teach her how wrong lying is. We have to continually teach my step-son the repercussions of lying are much worse then just telling the truth. It is really difficult on children when one parent doesn't care enough about their emotional stability to just do what is right for the child.

Hi L., First off, I sympathize with your situation. I went through something similar with my son. One of the first suggestions I would make is to contact her teachers and request a conference with you, her dad and her mother. This will not only show the teachers, but your step-daughter as well that ALL of you are involved. You also need to e-mail the teachers and make sure they are aware of your contact information so that when something arises you are informed as well as her mother.

As far as convincing her to not lie, well that is a little tougher. Knowing that you are involved with her teachers and her school the opportunity to lie diminishes greatly. Be sure to praise her for things you become aware of from her teachers that are good. Try volunteering at her school to. The more she see's your face and her father's at the school the more she will become comfortable letting you know everything that is going on.

I hope this helps. Good luck!
T.

This type of things go on all the time in divorced families and there is not a lot you can do about it.

If the child is 11 the why are you "ALLOWING" HER TO HAVE A BOY FRIEND AND DISCUSSING A BOYFRIEND/GIRLFRIEND SITUATION WITH HER.

SHE SHOULD BE BEING TOLD THAT SHE DOES NOT HAVE A BOY FRIEND NOR WILL SHE HAVE A BOYFRIEND UNTIL SHE IS AT LEAST 16. SHE SHOULD NOT BE ENCOURAGED.

L.,

Unfortunately for you and your husband the girls live with their mother who is the primary influence in their lives. If the mother agrees with her daughter about lying to her father to save face for herself, whether by omission or out right lying there is really nothing that can be done. She is setting up a situation that she will pay for very soon. If you allow a child to disrespect a parent in any way they eventually return the favor to you. They learn how to play a game that helps them win both ways. She will if she has not already begin to lie to her mom about things as well. When a parent puts a child in a position where they are compromising the basic morals or rules that they have been taught and does nothing to correct it, they have in the childs mind put them in a position of power that they are not ready for and don't know what to do with.

I would suggest you focus on showing her a better example in your home. You and your husband need to sit with her and explain to her in detail as if she were hearing it for the first time that you love her, don't expect her to be perfect and want to support her. Tell her you want her to understand that you care very deeply for who she grows up to be. Lying today is not worth the pain it causes tomorrow. Tell her that once you get caught up in the trap of lying it is hard to break it. If you go to church or not appeal to her about her future. Tell her that you are parents because God gave her as a blessing to you and that it is your job to guide her into being a woman of values and principles. She won't live at home forever and tell her that she needs to think of what kind of Man she wants to marry in the future and understand that all the things she finds important in a future husband he will also probably find important if he is a man of any value to her. Explain that he will probable want honesty as will she, faithfulness as will she. The point is to make her understand that her time at home is short compared to her married life and she needs to be the woman today that will attract the kind of man she wants for her future. We are not just raising children. We are raising future husbands and wives. Ask her if she would ever want her husband to encourage her children to lie to her and if and how bad would that hurt her. She needs to understand the pain she caused her dad. You have to equate it to her future so that she can understand how it felt. Then let her know that no matter what she does as long as she is honest and has not hurt anyone she will have no punishment. You will talk with her about what she did wrong and let her know that you are strongly unhappy. Tell her if she repeats the behavior again what the punishment will be next time. However if she continues to lie and you know it just keep upping the punishment. My daughter gets grounded for lying and has to sit in her room for one day and can do nothing but read. No, TV, Ipod, radio, family time or leaving the house for anything. If we go out we get a baby sitter who will follow our rules for her when we are gone. It was tough at first but she just knows now and hates it. She also tells the truth no matter what. We made it so that the truth looked much more appealing than the lie.

My oldest daughter who is 13 has a father who couldn't tell the truth if he tried. He is an alcoholic in denial and lucky for me she doesn't see him much. I never said anything bad about him to her because I knew that she loved him so much. I wanted her to be able to see his faults on her own and make her own opinions about him. I was afraid that if I told her the truth about him she may resent me later. Well she has it all figured out now and keeps him at arms length. This is not going to be an easy road for you because of her living with her mother. Just remember that kids do want discipline because when they grow up they equate that to care and love. She will grow up and know that you did care and love her and end up choosing for herself what is the right thing. You do this right and not be to harsh she will love you in the end. Remember you can't blame her for doing what she is taught.

Good luck

I certainly agree that your husband needs to contact the school and be certain that he is on the contact list. I would call evey month and check on her progress with the girls vice principal or a teacher. I even agree that a confrontation feels necessary with Mom. I have my doubts that this will accomplish much other than to give the two of you (you and your man) some satisfaction. If she feels you are unimportant, or worse, a threat to her postion as the MOM , nothing you can do will change her behavior from my experience .For her to be upset re: a confrontation you have to assume she really cares what either of you think or feel. Does she, I wonder. Now, your child- have you told her that yes, you know people lie. We do. BUT, a lie tells the parties involved that trust is not a part of the relationship. Does she know that when she fails to trust
you a great opportunity is missed? have you laughed and told her, hey, how can I be a great Mom if you never give me the chance to be one? Have you told her how very important she is- and that she is not responsible for the world, or her sister and her mom. Does she know that her dad, and you ,get that? That she is responsible at one home and it blows? This may not be her Moms' fault, CP is really tough....I bet an in school suspension or a trip to the principal's office when her bucket is full is a relief.

Just some thoughts. My yuongest helped nurse a cancer patient when in high school with me. The buscket just gets full quick.

Good Luck

My empathy goes out to your family and the X's. You have a couple of obstacles here that you cannot control, but patience and a lot of biting your tongue and biding your time will help. First of all, you are not a biological mother, and congrats to you for choosing to become a parent! It is hard, however, to understand when a parent will let their children get away with bad behavior. For many divorced parents there is a nagging fear they will be replaced by the "new" parent. This terror over losing your child's love is difficult for a non-biological mother/father to understand. Please have kind thoughts towards the X in this area. Another thing, when you enter an existing family, there is so much history and co-awareness of each other that you were not a part of, and never will be. This is not a bad thing, but it is very difficult for the step-parent, and sometimes hurtful. too. Once, again, be patient and caring. Third, 11 is a strange age for a girl. Believe it or not, she probably began the smallest subtle changes toward puberty 1 or 2 years ago, and she is suddenly becoming aware that her parents aren't perfect, and she has different ideas about how things should be done. This is the beginning of the "My parents are so stupid!" phase. Not fun. Fourth, she may feel guilty about her relationship with you and her Dad, and feel like she is betraying her mother when she enjoys her time with you. This can lead to seemingly unusual behavior in an otherwise great kid. Just let her know that although adults don't always get along as they should, she should not feel bad about her time with you. Reassure her that you and her father AND HER MOTHER love her more than anything. Say nice things about her mother to her and in front of her. NEVER NEVER NEVER disrespect her mother in front of her, no matter what is going on between you. You cannot change how her mother behaves or reacts. You can reinforce the rules (lovingly!) within your own household and encourage her to love all of you as a parental triangle. She sounds like a wonderful girl whose life--like everyone's--is becoming more complicated. If she knows she has strong, loving people to come to and confide in, it will work out. Trust me.
Sorry my answer was so long!

A little about me:

Was in your EXACT situation years ago, times 4 stepkids. Have an 11 year-old daughter of my own now. AM BEST FRIENDS NOW WITH THE EX!!!! It can all work out beautifully! My prayers are with all of you. :)

If this situation were to occur in my life with my daughters, I would sit down with both of them and let them know how much they are Loved, first and foremost, and how proud I am of them. Second, lying is not an option, it will only lead to more trouble, and that the truth is the best in any sitution. If her grades are great, and she is happy, then the truth will not get her trouble.
Sitting down as a family and discussing good things and bad things that happen and there consequences. They may come to realize that only good will come to being good, following rules and telling the truth.
I do not think that my 11 year old should have a boyfriend.
I think it will lead to even more lies,and more trouble. If the boy stuff starts now, there will be more lies, and the next thing that will happen is she's pregnant. I try to think of what went on when I was that age and what my friends were doing and what the boys were like. One of my best friends ended up having a baby at the age of 16,and she had to grow up really fast. She skipped school, and she lied all the time. Now she is 35 with a teenager. Praying as a family and reenforcing the truth is the best thing for everyone.