Co-parenting Isn't Working Out and Sending Mixed Messages

Regardless of her behavior, he shouldn't be hanging out at your place. You are not together and this infringes on your personal space. Moreover, she needs to learn that she has 2 homes and 2 competent parents, 2 places where she is love. She needs to see her parents as heads of separate households. His constant hanging out at your place is going to confuse her.

Do you think he's hanging out at your house specifically to undermine you as a parent? To make sure you have no other relationships? To show you what a cool dad he is? To get back with you?

If he picks her up for HIS time, he leaves. Have her bag packed and your keys in your hand so you are all leaving together and not hanging around at your house. You have your time, and he has his. If you can drop her off at his place and pick her up, that's good too although it is an imposition. Otherwise have him pick her up at your place (with you headed out), and then you pick her up at his place at the end of the visitation time to bring her back to your house. That way there is no prolonged time at your house and you break this habit.

If you find that he's not around when you are picking her up, then you will know he's more into controlling you and making you jump through hoops.

And all the special toys he buys her can stay at his house so she can "visit" them the next time. If he gets her hyped up on candy, he'll have to deal with it. The candy doesn't come into your house. Don't engage in conversation - he's responsible for her on his time, you're responsible on your time.

I'd stop talking to him about it (which doesn't work) and just start taking action. You can't control him, you can only control your own actions. If it doesn't work (like he's not there at pick-up time) and you have to have the attorneys get involved, it can be expensive. Parental alienation is taboo in legal circles - and that's what he's doing if he badmouths you to her and says you're the mean mommy or whatever.

But you are under no obligation to entertain him at your home.

Rules are going to be different in different places. That's the way life is. Just explain to your daughter that when she's at your house, YOU make the rules, when she's at grandma's, grandma makes the rules, and when she's with her Daddy, at his house, he makes the rules. When she complains, simply say "Mommy's rules." She'll catch on quickly.

Stop having your ex spend time with your daughter at your house. Just stop. He doesn't live there and it sends a lot of mixed messages. During his visitation time, they go to his house or the go to a park or anywhere else. But they don't stay at your house. If he decides to take her to the gas station and load her up with junk and toys, whatever. That's his time. She's not going to die of candy and toy poisoning. And the more you make it an issue, the more he's going to do it.

You can't "make" him do anything, he is a grown man.
All you can do is focus on what you will/will not allow in your home, under your guidance, and let the chips fall where they may.
Dads, especially absent dads, are going to be more lenient and giving, especially with sweets and treats.
So suck it up, and maybe next time you will think long and hard before making another baby with a "narcissistic man child."

Popsicle? You need to chill.

I draw the line at abusive behavior, like calling the kids names or stupid in my house. I also draw the line when he demands I punish them for him. Yes, the kids don't listen to him so he wants me to punish them so they are good for him. He is a great guy!

Thing is, own your part in this dance. Why are you setting him up to give her what you don't want her to have? If my kids ask me for something when my ex is at the house it is either something I have a yes for or the answer is hold on, we will talk about it after your father leaves. If it is urgent, like their friends are at the door we go in another room and talk about it. There is nothing my ex can do when we come back. The decision has been made, my house rules stand.

Right or wrong I see your actions as blaming your ex because you do not have control over your own child. Why was there no punishment for disobeying you? Your house, your rules, if he wants to give her a Popsicle he can do it when she is at his house.

You have no control over your ex nor should you expect to. Own your part in the dance, your house, your rules, you discipline. I have full custody of my kids now because they wanted the structure of my house. I am also the fun parent. :)

When I say punish I don't mean anything harsh, she took a popsicle when she was told no, it is no different than if she took it herself. Your ex has authority at your house because you are giving it to him. You gave it to him by acting like he has power in your home to override your authority. She accepted a popsicle you said no to so now she gets no popsicle tomorrow night after she finishes dinner. She is not too young to be taught your rules, that your ex is there doesn't matter.

I think its very bad to have him hanging out at your home. you both need your own place and then she will know she has two sets of rules. you will not be able to control what he does but you can control what you do with her in your home.
I also think this could send mixed messages to her. she doesn't remember what it was like before, so in her mind, she may think all parents live in this type of situation. as she goes to school and starts going to people houses, she will become confused.

there really is no reason to him having his parenting time at your house. you said your words have no meaning, and they don't. so instead, remove the possibility by not having him ever get the chance to undermine you. coparenting doesn't mean you have to be in the same room. it means you discuss and are active in her decisions like schooling, religion, activities. not popsicles before dinner

The only thing I want to add is that it's not fair to punish a 3 year old for something her father did. She's not mature enough to know that Mom trumps Dad, all she knows is that one of her parents gave her a popsicle so it must be ok. She doesn't "seem confused," she IS confused. Keep it between the two of you and don't make it a power struggle using your child. Stick to what you said, and parent without the other one present.

Drop off and pick up in a neutral location - store parking lot, etc. When he buys her toys, they remain at his house and she can play with them there. His time can't be spent at your house. He is only doing what you allow him to do. If you haven't already, you need to get a visitation schedule in writing and follow it.

I like the suggestion of a neutral pick-up and drop-off location. This will avoid a lot of the problems you are mentioning.

I can't give you any advice as to your soon-to-be-ex or what to say to him. He was who he was when you got together and made a child with him. He's not going to suddenly see your perspective on things now that you have split up. While Leigh's idea of taking a class together would be ideal, all you can do at this point is focus on making good boundaries and your own parenting.

If pickups continue at your home, ensure their ease by having your child ready and waiting outside, backpack ready, etc. Sit with her and read a story while you wait, then he gets out of the car, you say goodbye, go into the house and close the door, or get into your car and go. If you remove yourself, the hanging-out ceases to be a problem.

I think you already did the one main thing you can do, setting boundaries by not allowing him to hang out at your home. When it is his time with her he needs to pick her up at the door and not hang out at your house any longer, then he can not encourage her to defy you.

When he is on his own time at his own house, unless he is harming her in any way, you really don't have any control.

Great idea to ask him to just pick her up and go. That way it is very clear to her which parent is in charge.

I wonder if you might want to take it a step further. You could let him know that you will be taking her to his place and picking her up. That way you just drop her off and walk away or pick her up and drive away. No chance of him lingering.

It is true that all parents deal with this to an extent. I remember my mom telling me that one of the most important things parents need to do is be on the same page and speak with one voice. My husband and I really try for this, but we are only human.

So frustrating!!! Good luck!

Not funny but I have to laugh a little bc this isn't all about being divorced or separated. Married couples have these issues too... Counseling of course is good. Give him some parenting books. Try to calmly discuss. Use "nonviolent communication". When he gives in ask him why he did that. Then what does he think it teaches her. Keep asking questions bc that often leads someone to the right conclusion themselves vs feeling like they're being bossed around. Frustrating but lots of dads are kind of like this...

I think you did as much as you could by telling him that he can't hang out and co-parent at your house. Other than that, I don't think you should try to change him. It won't work, and you will drive yourself crazy.

It IS harmful for him to undermine you in your own home, but it's not all that bad if he parents differently from you when he is in his own home. Your daughter will just have to learn that there are different rules at different houses.

If it becomes a problem when she's a teen, you can re-address it then. Until then, you just tell her that daddy does things differently. Nothing wrong with that.

When it's his time with her, it needs to be just him and her. When it's your time with her, it needs to be just you and her.
When he tries to "hang out" at your house, tell him, "Time for the two of you to go now. See you later." Grab her suitcase and his elbow and head for the door if need be.

Have you and he had parenting classes or parenting counseling together? You truly need to do this. You are divorced but are forever yoked together as parents and need to be on the same page or at least reach a place where you don't undermine each other as he's doing to you. And some men will listen to a professional third party when they won't listen to their wives or their exes. He needs to learn what children her age need (like rules and a parent with the abiiltiy to think ahead) and you can learn how to choose your battles better so every cupcake and toy doesn't stress you out too badly. (I do agree--it would drive me nuts too but you can't control things that small.)

Since you say she behaves well for each of you separately, but has issues when dad is at your house -- you've already taken the first step by ending the times when he's at your house, period. It's like he's putting on a performance where he's fun dad to her and also sending you an unspoken message that as fun dad, he gets to make you look like mean mom. Don't give him any further opportunities to do that in your home.

Counseling for yourself could help you ensure that boundaries you want stay in place. But first should come parenting classes or counseling for you and him together to get you on the same page. If he refuses to go, get solo help for yourself anyway.

Sometimes it's not coparenting, it's parallel parenting. I guarantee you the child that lived at BM's house was not the child that lived here, because that's how her mom allowed her to be. We would hear from SS that she left the bathroom there trashed, but BM allowed it. Here, she had to pick up after herself, had a bed time, etc.

I suggest that you and your ex wean yourselves from situations where you are overriding each other. If you are both in the same place during his visit with her, then it is directly going behind your back vs doing things his way on his time. Kids will and do learn how to play both fiddles, depending on where they are, and they learn what will or won't fly. You can't control his behavior, but you also don't need to be antagonized by it.

I would also pick battles. If you are concerned about diet, then perhaps the pediatrician should weigh in so it's not just mean mom. Or if she brings back toys, then let them break and get thrown away. My SD would come back with new stuff every visit (I swear they only went to the mall) and once it was gone, it was gone.

Yes, he does want to be the cool parent, but you can also say "your time, your problem". Look up Disney parenting and parallel parenting. I agree very much that he needs to get his visiting out of your house. You need your space.

I also agree that there is no reason for him to have his parenting time at your house.

When my husband is home and our daughters want something I direct them to Daddy. This allows him to actively be involved. And it also means I'm not the only one making the parenting choices. We also openly discuss things in front of them. I find no point in hiding my feelings around them. But we're married and live together. This is what works for us. You need to do whatever works for you.

grrrr.
curtail strictly the amount of time your daughter spends with both of you together. when you're on the same page, it's a great thing to co-parent actively and have 'everyone together' time.
clearly it's not working for your dynamic.
khairete
S.

Statistics show that the mothers are the ones reading those parenting magazines, the latest parenting news, and are uber conscious of how they're parenting their children.
He is definitely out of line and she is definitely confused. You were right to keep him out of your home, but that isn't going to fix the problem.
Try explaining that 'Daddy does things different" and make a very clear list of what you expect of her (i.e. eat dinner THEN dessert, brush your teeth, etc.)
You're in for one heck of a ride and I wish you all the luck in the world.