Disciplining a Friends Child

J.,

Regarding being hit: I would definitely have gone straight to the mother and told her "your son hit me and I had him take a time out. I'm telling you because we all know it's never okay for a child to hit another person, especially an adult, and I thought you should know." Then, the ball is in her court as to how to proceed.

Your job is to make your own boundaries clear. Has your homeschool coop had a chance to go over ground rules and ensuring that all the adults are on the same page? I would be proactive with your friend and tell her in a 'just the facts' way "I've noticed that when I give X a direction, he is sticking out his tongue and making rude faces and noises. I want to be able to (teach,guide, whatever the reason you are working together) him and I would like to do it without his being rude to me." See what she has to say.

Were it me in a coop situation, I would simply have the child sit alone in a quieter place "You may sit here until you are ready to apologize for being rude and can follow my directions with a cooperative attitude." And then I would walk away. I would also tell that parent in advance "this is what I am going to do in the future". Kids in any instructional environment must learn to respect their teachers. Even kids who are in an unschooling environment must learn to be courteous and respect those from whom they are learning.

Your group might look into a book on classroom management called "Teach Like A Champion". So often, even in play schools, the biggest asset a teacher can have is a strong and grounded classroom management style. This will bring out the best in the kids, help them to want to learn, and to help them feel their best when they are doing their best.

I'd also say this: look at the child's overall attitude toward you. When he tries to make those connections, seize those opportunities to connect and to offer constructive feedback (instead of blanket praise) whenever possible. By this, I mean "Charles, you really listened to my directions and did that with such a cooperative attitude. Thank you so much." or "I saw you waiting very patiently for your turn with such good manners. High five!" Notice when he's able to master his impulses and does things which have been previously difficult for him successfully. It will be better than a rote "good job" and show him that you noticed his effort.

And for what it's worth, J., I ALWAYS back my son's teachers up, even if I don't 100% agree (and there have been a few times in the past I would have done things maybe a little differently--but they are in charge of that environment). It's better for me to double-check later with that adult (and get the whole story) than to have him argue with them or not mind. They have a tough job and one thing I am extremely clear about with my son is that he must listen to the adults who are in charge, whether he thinks it's 'fair' or not. He can talk to me later about it if he needs to, but he's not to argue with his teachers nor answer back to them or he loses privileges at home as well. We are careful about who we leave our son with, even at school. (I'd rather homeschool than send him to a teacher I didn't trust.)

PS: This bothered me last night, and I need to add: I agree with other posters that there is something bigger amiss if a child is hitting an adult. It sounds like you like the mom, but I have to say, I would never stay in a situation where this sort of behavior was continuing. I've left a playgroup because of the actions of one child who was being allowed to continue unsafe behaviors and their mom who was happy to let other people do her parenting for her. I do understand that kids are kids, but at 6 they should have it in their grasp to resist hitting others, especially adults. This makes me wonder what happens at home when the child hits mom and dad and what their response is. I know that in our house, if our son hit us in anger, all holy hell would break loose: there would be a firm scolding and a loss of privileges (like no legos/no stay-up time for a week).

In the future, do not discipline the child, but take him straight to mom, tell her what happened, and let her know that he may not be with your group for the rest of that day until he's apologized in writing and in person. She needs to see that *you* take it seriously or she will be enabled not to deal with it directly.

I'm so glad that the mom gave you a thumbs up. What a trial this kid is! I'm sorry you're going through this.

I think that if I were you, I'd ask his mom to keep him in her group at the next get-together. Tell her the reason is that he hit you at the last session and you need a break. Smile and laugh a little, but say it seriously.

Wow, a six year old hitting an adult is pretty shocking (unless it's a special needs/challenging child.) I would have immediately gone after him, taken both his hands in mine, got down on his level, looked him in the eye and said very firmly, WE DO NOT HIT. That kind of thing requires immediate action, not a time out. I also would have walked him over to his mother and made HIM tell her exactly what happened. This way he takes responsibility for his behavior, and by doing that understands he will be held accountable for his actions.
Sticking out a tongue at an adult is not quite as shocking but still very disrespectful.
Honestly, it sounds like you need a new group of friends, for both yourself and your children. These behaviors are not normal in this age group, not at ALL. My kids' friends have always been good kids. Have they sometimes played too rough or been mean to one another? Sure, but not a single one ever hit me, or stuck their tongue out at me, and I led three different scout troops over the course of ten years, so I have a LOT of experience working with LOTS of kids, of all different types and personalities.
What it really comes down to is: you need to be more selective with the people you hang out with.
I have no patience for brats, or the people who create them :-(

it sounds as if you have a really good working relationship with these other moms and are doing great. i wouldn't mimic, though. i know the intent is that it will show the child what he DOESN'T want to be, but kid brains rarely work that way. firm simple discussions and then firm non-negotiable consequences are best. i like time-outs or 'back you go to your mom' so long as the moms agree.
it won't always go well, of course. but so long as you and the other moms keep the lines of discussion open, you can work it out.
in one of our co-ops we had a schism between the 'let them be kids' moms (usually where i camp out) and the 'they are behaving dangerously' moms (where i moved when it got out of hand.) a group of boys were indulging in stick play, and it was getting pretty out of hand. when my kid, who was older than the stick-wielders, got nailed in the 'nads i called a meeting and asked for some order. the stick moms still felt that their kids should be allowed to do their thing, and that the older kids had the responsibility of getting out of their way. i told them sweetly that the 'natural consequence' to my kid getting hurt again would be that he could administer his own 13 year old justice as HE saw fit, including tit-for-tat.
the hairyassed apes behaved better after that.
it sounds like you too have a good group.
:) khairete
S.

You're so polite in how you describe this child. He's "very spirited and temper prone?" J., call it like it is. His behavior is out of control. He sounds like a disrespectful, undisciplined, violent little nightmare of a brat. Time outs aren't going to be effective with him. He needs to have consequences that are consistent and mean something to him.

I would suggest having a rule that when a child lashes out physically toward ANYONE they will be asked to leave immediately. If there are other discipline problems, such as rudeness to an adult, they get one warning and then a disciplinary action. One more warning and then they have to leave. Keep track in a notebook. You're going to need to have a parent meeting to establish appropriate behaviors and rules that break the behavior codes. Then the kids will need to all be sat down together and have the rules explained simply to them, and have the consequences explained.

At the beginning of each meeting, have a quick rundown of the behavior rules and consequences as reminders.

Call that child out in front of his mother for goodness' sake!

The next time you get together with that child and his mother, ask her if you can talk to him before he goes off to play. Then when you have both their attention, ask the child, for example, what he did to you when you did that craft together. He'll probably say "I dunno" or "Nothing", ask him if he stuck out his tongue at you. He'll probably deny it but anyway, let his mother know what happened with him there. Then ask her if she wants to know immediately when he does it again or wait until he does something else, and make sure you look at him while his mother answers.

That should put enough fear of God into him without humiliating him and at the same time teaching him how to respect grown ups.

Of course it could backfire on you and she could be one of THOSE mothers who thinks her kid can do no wrong. If that's the case, I suppose you might have to find other groups of moms/kids to spend time with as well.