Enforcing Bedtime with Newly Potty-trained Kiddo?

Stop feeding into her, don't engage with her when she is up, just quietly march her to the potty and right back to bed. IF she keeps getting up when she does not need to potty then give her a punishment. I always tell my kids that if they do not feel they can fall asleep at bed time the only thing they are allowed to do is read/look at a book quietly in their bed.

wait. you are 'convinced'? by a three year old?
i don't care how stinkin' cute she is, or how many frogs come into her room. this child desperately needs some firm loving boundaries, and not to have the responsibility of being in charge of the adults in the house.
it is ridiculous to claim you have a 'routine' when you don't. you listen to her talk and talk and tell wonderful stories, you let her make lists and spend hours ticking them off, you let her wander around as much as she wants, and melt when she gives you clearly BS excuses, however cute.
why on earth you choose to draw a line in the sand over a nightlight but not behavior is baffling.
she threw a 'mini fit' because instead of telling her, after FOUR TIMES, 'that's quite enough. you're going to be NOW' you succumbed and began a recitation that had nothing to do with her being out of bed for the FOURTH TIME.
she's a tiny, tiny girl with the bewildering job of managing an entire household and two helpless squishy adults.
relieve her of that burden.
khairete
S.

Thank you, Suz T.

Listen, many of us have been there/done that/have the tee shirt.
I had a kiddo who was nursed until 3, coslept with us up til then and then slept on our floor on a futon for about a year. We had our reasons (wanted him on the same floor with us, steep staircase)....

When we moved him to his own room, we got a LOT of the same behavior you are describing. "Come lay with me", etc. Wanting to talk, and talk, and talk.

When we decided we were ready to help him learn to deal with bedtime, I knew this was something we adults had to be fully committed to. We already had a good 'routine' in place, (stories, songs) it was the time after that short routine (about 20 minutes) that was when he would start up with the requests.

I decided to dedicate my time to correcting this. I actually put him to bed, told him "no more talking, you stay in bed" and then parked myself out in the hallway from his room with what I needed to pass the time pleasantly. One of the things I knew from prior experience is that I needed to be emotionally very neutral and calm when I responded to him, so I didn't want it to be a time when I was pulled away from a show or something else. My only job those first night was to teach him a new way of doing bedtime. So I actually put out a mat, a bunch of blankets and a pillow to sleep there as well.

The first night, he got up about four times. The first time I said "bedtime" walked him back to bed. He was a little sad, got up again, just took him by the hand. NO talking at this point, no explanations (they aren't helpful, you have already explained earlier, so don't give any more attention). No hugs, not tucking back in, nothing. Not even eye contact. Repeat, repeat, repeat. NO ADDITIONAL ATTENTION. I actually slept in the hallway and he got up at one to 'try it again'.... back to bed.

Perhaps that seems a bit extreme, but when we decide something is going to change, we are committed.

Night two, he got up a few times, maybe two or three. I spent the evening camped out again, but slept in my own bed. By nights three and four, my husband was also in charge with this and Kiddo got a very clear picture that bedtime was now going to be this way. Period.

He's a lot older now, but knows that if he starts up at night, he loses tv/media privileges the next day.

Stop getting sucked in, be firm. Get a new baby monitor and nightlight-- whatever you need. Be the adults and help your kid learn that when mom and dad say time for bed, she needs to sleep. Or at the very least, lay quietly in bed. Stop talking to her about all of this--she doesn't understand what "nine o'clock" is. Stop explaining-- set the expectation with your own actions. And I'd start bedtime a lot sooner-- it sounds like she might be overtired?

Totally agree with Suz T.

And as for her needing to potty as an excuse to get up, fine. She doesn't need an audience to go use the potty and then straight back to bed. It's really kind of boring to use the bathroom without someone to chatter on and on with and recite lists and discuss tomorrows routine.

My daughter potty trained at 2, and she went through a very brief period where getting up 10 minutes after lights out was a novelty. She "had to go potty" of course. Otherwise, she was an excellent "go to bed" kid. No issues whatsoever. So after about the 3rd night, I began to ignore her when she got up for the potty. No extra good night hugs and kisses. No audience to make sure she actually did anything in the potty. I might've helped her with the sink to wash her hands, but that was it. I didn't accompany her back to her room/bed. I turned off the bathroom light and went back to whatever I had been doing before after a quick "goodnight" was said. That's it. She got over the novelty fairly quickly.

The "I'm thirsty" was solved by a small cup of water with about 2 inches in the bottom, left by the bedside/night table.

Stop engaging her when she should be in bed.

And if she isn't tired, perhaps you should look at your daytime routine as well. Is she playing actively most of the day? If not, you might want to step up her physical activity so she is actually more tired at bedtime.

I'd stop all the discussion about the morning - too much thought going into things (like whether or not there are muffins) and she's focusing on all that activity instead of on calming down. If you really need to tell her a day ahead that you'll pick her up from school, tell her that at 4 PM. The next morning is the time to remind her of what was decided yesterday. Daddy can get her up and give her muffins and whatever the deal is. I think you are giving her too much stimulation at night by going through the whole routine. If you want to lay out her outfit the night before to minimize distractions in the morning, fine, but do it at the very start of the bedtime routine. The bedtime routine needs to be consistent, as you say, but I'd focus more on what actually calms her down than on what she WANTS to do. I'd move bedtime up to 8 PM instead of 9 PM, and I'd say she can get up for the potty and NOTHING ELSE.

We used to sing "Good Night Ladies" but change the words to "Good Night, David (3 times), it's time to go to sleep." Then we'd add in some verses about the past day, not the next - "We had a good day, we went to the zoo,…." just making up words and squeezing them into the melody by just mashing up some syllables. Nothing exciting, just calming. Then we added in "Sweet dreams, David….", getting quieter and quieter, and slower and slower. We found his breathing calmed down, his squirming calmed down, and the constant singing by one of us kept him from interrupting and making conversation. It was the same idea as a story (when kids are quiet and listening) but done with the lights off (or with a nightlight on). We usually lay down near him but not so close that he'd sense us getting up as he dropped off to sleep, but you could also do it sitting by the bedside and rubbing her head or holding her hand.

If she's totally capable in the bathroom, leave the light on in there and not in any other rooms, and tell her she can go there on her own, with no talking. The other thing you can do is put a kiddy potty in her room and leave the nightlight on. Put some squares of TP next to it or put some wipes there, whatever she's used to. She's probably just peeing, not pooping, right? So since urine is technically sterile, she doesn't need to wash extensively. I don't like hand sanitizer and I think it adds an extra step, but if you feel strongly about it, you could put some there. But I imagine she would just play with it. Anyway, she doesn't get to come out of the room to use the bathroom because she's coming to you and talking, getting drinks, getting hugs, giving you her baby, etc. etc.

You could put her in a pull-up so she isn't nervous about staying dry all night, if you want to make the break from diapers. Most kids are not reliably dry at night at the age of 3 - and they are often agitated about being a "big girl" when they are asleep.

I think you have to take her choices out of the bedtime routine - the discussion of why you decided certain things (like muffins) is getting her riled up so she can't calm down, so she has a tantrum.

You could also try a CD player of lullabies that taper off in volume, or an air filter type device that provides white noise if you think she is reacting to house noises. For some kids, it blocks out other stimuli and helps with constancy.

If you have to, take a few nights on a weekend when she doesn't have to get up for school, and keep putting her back to bed without talking or engaging her, and put a childproof doorknob lock on the door so she cannot get out. It's her choice to go to bed or to scream. Put the potty in there so there's no nonsense with having to pee. But no, she stays in her room for the night until she can stop getting up to wander around. Eventually she will get tired and if the potty is there she won't be wet. SHe's doing this because she can - she's getting a payoff for it. And that payoff is your attention.

But don't keep changing it up every single night. That will make things worse.

During the summer break from school my girls got in the habit of talking/playing in bed for 30 to 60 minutes after they were put to bed. So we put them to bed 40 minutes or so before we actually wanted them to fall asleep. Worked like a charm.

Now that school has started, we have explained that they won't earn screen time if they keep coming out of the room or if they are being too wild.

Come up with a consequence that you will wholeheartedly enforce and tell your daughter what said consequence will be if she messes around at bedtime.

Good luck.

Oh my god, that's so cute!: "frogs came into her room" or "the moon came into her room" or "eagles came into her room".

You really need to videotape some of this, you will love watching it in retrospect.

How darn, darn cute. Enjoy her.

Good luck with the sleep and the bedtime. It passes. Others can give you advice. I, a sad empty-nester, just think it's adorable.

You can TELL her all day long, but she knows that she can play this game and that you and daddy will play with her. She has absolutely no incentive to change anything.

IMHO, you do not have to allow her access outside of her room at night just because she's potty trained. No liquids for an hour prior to bed; go potty before going to bed; if you think she needs it, get her up to go before you go to bed. That should take care of that.

Then, put a baby gate across her bedroom doorway. If she's a climber, use two, one on top of the other. She MUST stay in her room. Period. Do not play her games. She can stand there calling you all night - you know she doesn't really NEED you, she WANTS you. Huge difference.

You have let this go on for so long that it is going to take a LOT of time to change. Don't expect overnight results.

And last night's fiasco should teach you WHY you don' have a conversation with them at this time. That's just another way of keeping you in the room, and her not sleeping. You CANNOT reason with a 3 year old - stop trying.

Thank you for posting this question. Our kid is good about going to bed and staying in bed and falling asleep (sometimes it takes 5 minutes, sometimes it takes an hour, but he stays in bed). Our kid isn't dry at night yet, but manages through his nap. Been wondering what changes might follow when and if he is dry at night. The suggestions you've received are good ones that I will keep in mind when our turn comes.

Best,
F. B.

I love Suz T.'s response. Perfect.

I want to add a couple things.

1. No nightlight in her room. A nightlight in the bathroom? Okay. But not in her room. If it's dark she can't see the frogs or eagles.

2. Light blocking curtains. Then the moon isn't coming in.

3. Flip the doorknob so the lock is on the outside. She goes potty before bed, you say goodnight, lock the door to keep her safe from frogs and eagles and wandering, and once she's asleep, unlock it so she can access the bathroom if she wakes and needs to use it.

When our son was that age he couldn't sleep if he thought he was missing anything.
We were ALL tired by the end of the day so his bedtime was OUR bedtime.
We turned off all the lights in the house, he had his night light in his room and if he woke up in the night he'd make a beeline for me in our bedroom across the hall from his.
We NEVER had to worry about him wandering the house at night.
Every time he left his bed and woke us up we'd take him back to his room.
Eventually he wised up and just came to our room and tucked himself in at the foot of our bed without waking us up.
We'd find him there in the morning.
My personal theory is toddlers/pre-schoolers just don't like sleeping alone.
In the wild - unattended young are prey.
I think the wanting to sleep with/near an adult is a left over instinct from way back.
Try putting a sleeping bag next to your bed.
Settle your child into her own bed at her bedtime (start your routine earlier if she's making it last later) and if she wakes up in the night she can come to the sleeping bag hopefully without waking you up.

Sounds like she's just not tired yet. I hate when bedtime is that hard.

As for the potty trained at night.

People aren't supposed to wake up to go pee at night. That's something that's odd to me when people talk about waking up to pee or kids getting up. We're not supposed to do that.

People that do that often have things like diabetes or bladder disease. Kids AND adults are supposed to go to bed and sleep all night then wake up in the morning. Then they feel their bladder filling and have to go right away and have a lot of urine.

She's also pretty young to be potty trained at night, good for her to do this. I'd say she doesn't need to get up. If she is actually peeing then I guess she needs to go. I'd put up a gate in the hallway and lock the doors on all other room except the bathroom. I'd also put faucet protectors on the tub and sink so she can't fill the bathtub or leave the water running.

I always had a baby monitor set up so I could hear the kids. I had it sitting in the hallway on top of a book shelf with the other end in my room.

Is she tired during the day when she stays up past her bed time? If not, have you considered that she just might not be tired? 9:00pm to 8:30am is 11.5 hours. While some kids do need as much as 12 hours a night, not all do. My kids have been sleeping 10:00pm to 7:30am since they were that age. I know if I were to sleep until 8:30am there would be no way I could lay down and fall asleep at 9:00pm. Maybe try a later bedtime or an earlier wake up and see if she is better able to settle down to sleep.