Need Advice Quick If Possible

Is there any way you can get the other parents together and this weekend disinfect the classroom(s) and be on campus while the class airs out and continue to do so until the illnesses are out off campus. I would happily give up 1/2 a sat in a rotation (the well kid moms would do this preferably so to not bring in the sick kid germs). I also agree the petition is a good idea to get the parents involved in getting different cleaners in the classroom there are Non Toxic disinfectant cleaners available. Melaleuca is a great product that Jaimee K. suggested LOVE IT!

Asking clear questions is always good - who, how often. I know in my daughter's 3rd grade classroom, the kids clean their desks with wipes every day. And part of their back to school supplies which they all buy is a large hand sanitizer - so they sanitize in class and after they use the computers. One person certainly can't sanitize every door and desk every day - but a classroom can take care of itself.

Maybe discuss it with other parents and get a petition going. Get a letter from your pediatrician stating what you said. Maybe write a letter to the school admistration and school board. You seem to be very articulate in your writing and seems you can make your case better that way. Also if you do decide to discuss this with other parents, maybe they are feeling the same way about it and one of them can do the talking. Go with them to the meeting in support. Just an idea. Or just go yourself and tell them exactly what you have told us here. They will just have to get past the accent. Don't let that worry you. Go voice your concerns. Good luck!

I don't really think what they are cleaning with has anything to do with it. Our school uses regular cleaners, clorox wipes, antibacterial hand gel, etc and my kids have had a horrible year. I think it's more to do with people not keeping their sick kids home or home long enough. Last year they were really strict bc of h1n1 and the big freak out that came with it this year everyone is back to their more relaxed ways.

One thing you might want to think about as a continuous cause of illnesses in schools is The Lunchroom.

There are multiple classes of kids all sitting right on top of one another. Are the tables being cleaned properly between classes??

I've worked in public schools for 13 years and I have never seen ANYONE clean the tables between lunch periods. The kids are in charge of throwing out their garbage and picking up, but I have never seen anyone actually wipe down the tables. Ever.

Your child's classroom teacher may try and disinfect her classroom and have the children wash their hands and such, but those yucky lunchroom tables are simply loaded with germs.

Maybe you can ask the teacher what the procedure is for cleaning the tables between lunch periods. In the meantime, send the kids to school with those really small bottles of hand sanitizer and tell them they are to use it immediately after lunch.

Good luck. Sorry your kids have been so sick.

Peace.

Overuse of antibacterial products lead to bacteria that's resistant to it. So, the use of antibacterial products isn't the end-all solution. I would think that it would be better to stress hand-washing, sneezing and coughing into your elbow, and not sharing items. When a bug is particularly bad, I don't think using antibacterial items is a bad idea. But for general use, I'd avoid it. Save it for when it's really necessary.

There's evidence that children who grow up in an overly-clean environment are sicker later on. Their immune systems don't develop properly. They end up getting more allergies, asthma, and less immunity to the types of diseases one generally is exposed to in childhood. A little dirt and illness when young actually makes them healthier when they get older. Not that you want things filthy, but you really don't want it completely sterile either, odd though that sounds.

So, I hear what you're saying about the kids getting sick a lot, but I'm not sure that attempting to create a completely sterile environment with antibacterial products is entirely the answer either, except, of course, if the illnesses are severe or rampant.

Also, there's the matter of cost. If they only have one cleaning person and are using only water or vinegar, it may be a funding issue. They may not be able to hire more cleaning staff or buy more expensive anti-bacterial cleaning products.

Since it's a private school, vote with your pocketbook. Get some parents together to demand a change or you will leave. One or two students leaving won't affect the school much, but if a bunch do it, it will get noticed. Make sure you understand that tuition may need to go up to pay for it, though.

If a tuition increase isn't acceptable, perhaps, as a community service project, a group of students and parents could volunteer to disinfect classrooms. Or purchase better cleaning products. Or raise money to hire another janitor.

Depending on where you live, public schools can be wonderful or horrible. If you're in a decent district, public school is just as good as the private alternative and it's free. Of course, if you're not in a decent district...

I use a disinfectant that lasts for a couple of days when left on a surface. There is no bad odor either. It can come in the form of a "wipe" so that you don't have a big bottle of something dangerous sitting around since it is not concentrated...... therefore doesn't need a safety cap. That said, it's great for places where there are kids!

I would speak to the the school without pointing any fingers. I would also acknowledge their concerns, and limited control. Here is an example?

"I am concerned with all the illness at our school this winter. I know how hard it must be for you to combat illness and keep the children up on their work. I would like to help. If I could offer you some cleaners that are safer than what has been used in the past would you consider them?" Maybe you can even offer to organize and start a campaign to have Mom's come in on Monday mornings and Wednesday after school to clean each classroom.

Administration will respond better to someone who wants to help and not just tell them what they should be doing.

One more thing.......your pediatrician....... I think he/she was just saying certain viruses can recycle back, but I don't think he/she was saying you can't still build your child's immune system so that he/she gets sick less often or that his/her illnesses will be milder.

ABSOLUTELY, I believe you can build your child's, and your immune system. My family is living proof. My husband used to get 5 sinus infections or more each year. That just doesn't happen anymore. In fact this winter neither of us has been sick even once, and he flies to different cities almost weekly for work. Do you know how miserable that used to be with constant sinus infections?

I've seen folks with lupus that were constantly sick improve by leaps and bounds. There is plenty you can do to build your immune system.

I would probably focus more on the schools sick policy and whether or not they are allowing sick children to stay in school, also I would perhaps come up with a plan to have a presentation given regarding the steps to stay healhthy such as hand washing, sneezing into your arm or tissues, etc. I feel that the school can sanitize as much as they want but just like my workplace, if the sick kids don't stay home, then its just going to keep going round and round. Simple soap and water honestly should be enough and then good hygience and a strict sick policy! Even at work, this is an issue, people need to stay home when they are sick and they need to keep their kids home when they are sick!

As another very educated mom with an accent whose chid is getting sick a lot, I UNDERSTAND, and I actually agree with you!
My daughter is 4 and she's been getting very sick, although no strep or infections, just stomach bug and colds with a couple of fevers.
They do use bleach and disinfecting wipes at their school, although I don't use them at my home, and I"m OK with them doing this because I know how much worse it would be.
As much as I'm a "green" mom I also know that before scientific discoveries and immunizations, life was Ugly, Brutish, and Short!

That said, I think you need to arm yourself with facts before going there and JUST stick to the facts!
Check on google the best way to prevent illness specifically in school/preschool. What are the best products to use. Does it really make a difference between using just vinegar versus other methods such as antibacterial and bleach? Your doctor might be able to give you some good resources.
After you find online, in facts and coming from doctors, exactly what you wish you tell them in words, Make as many copies/print them out/ of these as there will be people in the meeting! If you can't then print a copy for the administration and a couple of copies to be passed around.
Then just say: I am very concerned about our kids getting as sick as they are, and after much research on the subject and also talking to my child's pediatrician, I also want to share my concern with you.
HERE is the research that I found that comes highly recommended from the medical community and is based on FACTS.
I strongly urge you to read it and think about it. ANd please let me know if you share the same concerns as me.

ULTIMATELY, you should always have a backup plan! If no one agrees, do NOT stop listening to your instinct. Take your kids to a "bigger spaced" classroom with less kids and where their cleaning methods match what you're looking for!

Good luck and let me know how it goes or if you have any questions!
I.

From doing just some quick research, it does seem that there is disagreement as to the effectiveness of vinegar as a cleaner/disinfectant. There is also the question of the cleaner's (the person's) effectiveness in cleaning. No matter what substance is being used to clean, if the cleaning is not being done thoroughly, germs will live. I'm not sure one person can clean a whole school effectively.

I agree with your approach of getting more information first. Good luck with this effort!

Say everything you just said to us. That sounds good. Make it clear that of course you are concerned for your own kids but you are worried about all the kids in the school. Tell them what your doctor told you.

Good Luck :-)

Edit: Are there any other parents you can get on board with this?

Unless you're going to also "sanitize" the playground equipment and EVERY child's home, EVERY parent's work place and have people "sanitized" upon entry- you are fighting a losing battle.

Germs are everywhere. Kids get sick. It has been a very cold winter, so they are outside less and indoors with closed windows and re-circulated air more.

You may want to talk with the principal about inviting the county health community educator to come in a do a kid-friendly presentation on hand-washing and "coughing" ettiquette. My BIL did this for a while while in school and the kids loved it.

Of course they are concerned, but they cannot control what goes on it people's homes. They cannot keep a parent from sending their sick kid to school only to be sent home by 10:00, they can't keep a sick parent from coming in and coughing on your child while volunteering.

As my grandmother would say... is this really the hill you want to die on? Probably not.

There are natural products that clean and disinfect. Melaleuca has some that are very inexpensive. Just an FYI because I'd be concerned like you and my kids would be constantly sick from the cleaners they use. So it's a lose-lose for some.

These are very interesting informative articles:
https://greencleaning.ny.gov/faq.aspx
http://www.ncef.org/rl/cleaning.cfm
www.health.state.ny.us/diseases/.../health_advisory_2008-...
http://www.cleaninginstitute.org/custodians_answer_the_call/
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/10/16/health/webmd/ma...
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/23/nyregion/23schools.html
http://daycare.com/forum/showthread.php?t=540
http://www.educationworld.com/a_issues/chat/chat228.shtml

You might want to see what the Laws are, in your State, per sanitizing/cleaning schools, are.

If an accent makes you sound rude, preface your comments with that. Start by saying something along the lines of, "I know that my accent can make my comments sound harsh, but I'm not trying to accuse anyone, I am just concerned for the health of the kids." They need to use sanitizers. I'm actually surprised that they are able to get away without using them. Even greenworks, works. I can understand not using them when the kids are in the classroom (except for spot cleaning), but the rooms need to be disinfected along with toys, etc.

This is a particularly bad season in my house, even with a daycare that does sanitize, I can't imagine one of my kids being in a place that didn't sanitize.

Our school uses regular cleaners and bleach to sanitize things and it has still been an awful year for sicknesses. The strep throat outbreaks seem to never end. And the stomach flu has been running rampant. Not to mention colds and flu bugs. We have never had so much sickness before in our family and it is all due to our 1st grade son catching things and bringing them home! So, perhaps even if you can get your school to change it will not really do a thing.

Hi L., all my kids have had 'those years' when it seemed like they were sick from pretty much Sept-May. And then they had years where they didn't get much of anything at all.
Yes our school uses antibacterial EVERYTHING (although I steer clean of antibacterial EVERYTHING).
In the school I worked in we used Clorox, on EVERYTHING, even soaked TOYS every day in bleach, and wiped everything down all day with antiseptic wipes. Some years kids were especially sick, some years they weren't.
I think you should approach it just the way you did with us! Sounds like a perfectly reasonable request that a parent would raise this question.

:)

They need to use 'real' cleaning products in my opinion. Something that WILL get rid of the germs... preventitive measures are everything! I am the biggest germophobe... I send my kids to school with hand sanitizer and strict instructions to wash wash wash those hands, keep everything away from their mouths, know the proper way to cough/sneeze (and tell your friends!)... when H1N1 was running rampant, I sent in face masks for the kids in my childrens classes, no joke. The school is required to sent home notification if any one illness is being spread around school like wildfire, and I usually keep my girls home the next day (or two) so they can properly sanitize and air out the place. I HATE GERMS. Can't stand snot. Makes me cringe just thinking about it! I honestly think this is one of those instances where you CAN put your foot down and be a little pushy; it's childrens health and well being at stake. They can not get a proper education if they're out sick all the time!! Good luck :)

I would not let my kids go to a school that only used vinegar and water for cleaning! I don't care how great it's supposed to be, would anyone be comfortable going to a hospital and having surgery if they only cleaned with vinegar and water? I don't think so. I LIKE smelling some Clorox, Lysol or bleach when I go to my kid's school!

Tell the director in your nicest voice (regardless of your accent), this -in this way: "Hi, we have had so much sickness this winter! It's been really rough. I was wondering why the school banned the use of cleaning products beyond vinegar and water? Do you think that could explain why all the kids have been particularly sick this year?" See what the response is -if you're told "No," then just say that you are very concerned that the vinegar isn't killing enough of the virus and bacteria causing the stomach bugs and strep like Lysol would, and have they thought about using cleaners again? I would ask if they think it would be safe for a hospital to only use vinegar and water. Seriously, if this is a public school, I would go to the school board if I had to.

**I just read that it's a private school! You and the other parents demand for them to change or yank your kids. Tuition money talks! YOU are the boss here, because you're paying for it. Organize the other parents, go to the administration and tell them that you find it completely unacceptable to only clean with vinegar and water. If the principal is problematic -remind her that she can be replaced easily.