My DD is in 6th grade. She goes to a school outside our zoned school, as she is very bright and attendance is a reward for hard work. It is somewhat inconvenient, however the program suits her well. My question is somewhat long and convoluted. I apologize in advance.
She has done well all year (all A's, all mid to upper 90's all year). I checked her grades this morning,and saw that one of her grades dropped to a B (89.1) due to a paper that she needed to correct and return. I told her to meet the teacher after exams to correct her paper before she left, then sent an email to the teacher, who said that she had until tomorrow to correct. He said she could have corrected it after her exam yesterday, but she swears she did not know she had to correct the paper until it showed on the computer grade log. I told her to stay on top of her grades at the end of the year, and it appears she did not follow my advice.
She called me before getting on the bus, and said the teacher told her "It was too late" to do anything about her grade. I told her he emailed me and told me she had until tomorrow. I called and talked to the teacher, who said she walked past his classroom, and he was behind her and caught up to her and she said "what do I need to do to get my A back." That doesn't seem to be the way she would talk, and she says that she went to him (that he was outside his class) and that he told her it was "too late", so she came home. He said she had an attitude and didn't earn an A, and she could not correct the work as he said in the email. He went on to say her attitude the last 9 weeks was poor (she had comments up to the last progress report for many classes good participation, etc.) I was not aware of any attitude issues. The teacher said she did not make it a priority to go to him, and that kids were stopping in to see him all day. She said she was in exams. I do not know when the grade that needed to be corrected was posted (but it was definitely sometime between last Friday and this morning). I do not know/was never told her attitude had changed. Her grades were not as high of A's as they had been, and I figured it was end of year fatigue, but this one paper dropped her from a 91 to an 89.
I don't think my kid is perfect. She tends to be a "know it all," and she may not be well liked because of it. My husband and I try to work with her on this, as she always has a comment about something she read on a subject, saw, etc. We are trying to teach her that there is no need for her to comment on every subject. She has friends and is semi-popular. She goes to functions, gets invited to or has parties, etc.
I would have to say that teachers do not like her personally, since she did not receive good student recognition awards (the core subjects recognized 20-30 kids for her grade level. Her lowest year end average was a 93, her highest was a 106). She is not disruptive in class, as I have asked, and she always gets complements on her co-operation, teamwork, etc. She also has several positive comments on her report cards/progress reports for these classes.
My husband and I went to the school, and spoke with the vice-principal. I said that I did not think she should suffer because the teacher determined she had an "attitude." The vice-principal even said he was surprised to hear this as he has seen her around and she is never in trouble or one of the kids with attitude. He asked us to leave and called the teacher, who said she had the folder and because he told me so, she had to return the work before 11 am. Well, she swears to us and the vice principal that she never saw the folder and the teacher had it. Turns out, the teacher did. He handed it to her and said 11 tomorrow. We get home, and she got a 95 on her final exam and it pulled her up to an A again. I am still having her do the work, of course.
I am extremely disappointed, first by the lack of recognition during the award ceremony, and secondly by the teachers reaction. I am frustrated with my daughter that she did not know about this, but it isn't clear that she should have, even though the teacher swears she should have.
If there is no benefit in attending this school, I want to pull her out and have her go to her zoned school. I don't like the way this was handled at all. There were one or two other incidents poorly handled (for example, my mother-in-law died two days before mid-terms, and it was a teacher based decision on whether she would have incomplete grades. One teacher closed her grade and gave her a 0, which dropped her from a 99 to a 91, but I decided it wasn't worth discussing. My other daughter attends a different school and all her mid-terms were excused). Due to her failure to stay on top of things, she is being punished, the extent of which my husband and I still need to discuss. I feel there is more that needs to be uncovered, and I do not think my daughter is blameless, so is this an over reaction? Do you need a nap after all this?
DD got a 95 on the final, so it ended up being moot. My main problem, which did not come across clearly was that the teacher told her she could re-do the paper (this is class policy, not something special for my DD), I asked via email if after classes today was OK, because it was the last day of classes. He said the next morning was OK, then saw my daughter and told her it was too late, and when I asked why it was different than what he told me, said it was because of her attitude. That seemed punitive to me which was why I went to the vice principal who decided the teacher had to stand by what he said.
I got off track trying to bend over backwards to try to explain that I know my kid isn't perfect. I know she is not blameless. The change of gears was inappropriate, and less mature than the 6th graders he teaches.
The award thing was my frustration. I am going to think more, but I am leaning toward pulling her out. I like the extra classes available to her, but she did not earn the privilege of continued attendance.
Holy micromanagement, mama.
Listen, she earned the 89.1. That's it. That's what she got. There is no re-dos in the real world. Not in middle, high school, college, and beyond. If you aren't happy at this school, you won't be happy at another. Have you been into many middle schools? If this is all you're dealing with, you have no idea how lucky you are!!
She earned an 89.1.
Accept the fact.
My 3rd grader understands deadlines.
Much like weight, remember a grade is only a number. :)
Okay, I think that this is all a bit crazy, but I understand where you are coming from wanting a correct grade. I think she is old enough to begin learning how to fight these types of battles on her own though, this may have required help. If she is a bit of a know it all as you say, people in general tend to be snarky because know it alls tend to come of as snarky as well. Over the summer I would put a WHOLE LOT of emphasis on learning this lesson. My mother tape recorded me for a week in random conversations (I too can be a know it all) and then played them back WOW did I NOT realize the way I could be percieved, same as an adult but I do try to pay more attention to it. In regards to the mid terms, I think all schools, like work should allow a bereavement time regarding attendance, schoolwork and testing. I do not see her having the same teachers next year, but I cold see this causing a reputation for being a "difficult family" and starting next term off on a bad foot. I think it may be a good idea to have her in her home school and go from there for next year.
Added after your SWH:
"... I am leaning toward pulling her out... she did not earn the privilege of continued attendance". I am shaking my head at your thought process here. I feel very sorry for your daughter having to live up to your standards, B..
Original:
Too much, mom. You are overreacting. She needs to learn the lesson of what happens when she mis-steps. What she doesn't need to learn is that you will go fight a battle for her on "he said/she said". You are setting yourself up to be the teachers (plural) least favorite parent, no matter WHAT school you put her in.
There are kids who actually say things like "Do you know who my parents are?" from seeing this kind of stuff. You don't want the kind of kid who acts like that.
She needs to learn from her mistakes. Going to the teacher to demand a re-grade isn't going to do it. Going over the teacher's head isn't either.
If you keep trying to "uncover" here, you will be the talk of the teacher's lounge. So uncover if you must, and then move her to the other school. When you've become the talk of THAT teacher lounge, where will you take her then?
Stop trying to "uncover" and let your little girl learn some life lessons, Mama. She needs this, and honestly, so do you.
Dawn
Yes, I think you over reacted. You're focusing on the school and making this the school's fault when the more serious issue is your daughter's attitude. In the 6th grade the teachers have 5 or 6 classes of students and cannot keep up personal correspondence with parents. Her attitude has changed in the last few weeks. This is common at this age.
I also suggest that the attitude that got her in trouble with the grade just occurred and he is telling you about it. I suggest that up until now the attitude wasn't so important.
I urge you to back off on the accusations and start listening to the teacher's explanations.
Geez, you assume that the teachers don't like her because she didn't get awards. Never make assumptions. It is doubtful with so many students that a teacher is going to dislike a student for that reason. Perhaps dislike to deal with them because she has an attitude. Again, the problem comes back to your daughter.
Is it possible that her attitude stems from not receiving awards?
Deal with the attitude. Don't get sidetracked into excusing it and making it someone else's fault.
I also suggest that punishment is not the answer. Teaching is needed here. Listen to her reasons for her attitude and help her find ways to change her behavior to take care of the reasons.
When we punish instead of instead of making the consequences fit the behavior we only create more anger. She already has the natural consequence of lower grades. Be sympathetic and talk about the reasons for the attitude and how she can change her attitude.
Oh. I get it! After your SWH. The key here is that she did not go to the teacher and ask for a redo. The teacher followed her down the hall on her way out of the school and BECAUSE she did not come to him was no longer offering the redo. She didn't ask which is part of the attitude reason for changing his mind. Was she humble and did she apologize? Sounds like she did not. Sounds like she may have an entitlement problem. Definitely sounds like you feel that she's entitled to chance after chance. Instead, I urge you to teach her that doing it right the first time is the way to go. Then, if the teacher is willing to offer a redo, that she immediately go to the teacher and thank him. He certainly doesn't have to offer a redo. And it's reasonable to take the privilege away when the student doesn't meet the criteria.
I certainly do not recommend changing schools. The lesson to be learned is how to get along with the rules and expectations of the school. She'll have a new set of rules and regs in the new school and will just be starting over learning how to get along.
Thanks for adding the last sentence, because I must kindly say that yes, I do need a nap after reading this.
Don't helicopter parent and micromanage your daughter. Let her learn her lessons. This is only a B, or a B+ in 6th grade.
I vote for "overreaction." I think instead of talking to your daughter's teachers so much, you should simply talk to her. "I hear you sometimes come off as having an attitude. Do you know why you might appear that way?" Also, not everyone receives awards, nor should they.
I was over-involved with my first child's schoolwork, too, so I get it. But let go.
I'm assuming she's in some type of accelerated/gifted program/school. If special consideration is used to admit high achieving students, then it doesn't surprise me that more is expected of the students in this program/school. If a kid is not taking personal responsibility for themselves, and not taking things seriously, they are taking the place of a kid that might be more deserving than them.
Yes, it sounds like a bit of a miscommunication, but I think that it happens from time to time throughout a child's school career. Truth is, you weren't there, and most kids are not going to tell their parents if they messed up, when they can just blame the teacher.
Also, it might be time, again, to talk to her about her "know it all" tendencies, which could most definitely be construed as "attitude", as the teacher put it. It's putting her at a disadvantage, as unfair as it is, and she will most likely continue to be labeled as such & suffer the consequences tied to that label.
As far as being recognized - you have no idea what the talents are of the other students, or what their overall demeanors are. We all think our kids are great, but there is always someone that did better or achieved more.
You are over reacting and instead need to stop p let your daughter suffer the consequences of HER behavior.
Remember thew saying all the way back to kindergarten from the teachers?
"If you will promise to believe 50% of what your child tells you goes on in school, I will believe 50% of what your child says goes on at home.. "
This situation is all of your DAUGHTERS fault.
She got the B.
She did not correct it or speak with the teacher.. Heck you were the one that told her the grade.. That should be her responsibility.. This is what middle school is all about. Teaching the students to stay organized, to take responsibility for the their own work and to work on the weaknesses they each have.
She did not get any awards because other kids did a better job than her.. They may have been OVER all student.. not just academic.. attitude, being able to problem solve, to accept responsibility for ones own action and also growing in maturity this whole last year.. is probably what these awards or recognitions were being awarded for.
Again.. this is her problem.. It may not be important to her to be a goodie 2 shoes.. Maybe that is not her natural behavior.
If you think it is something she needs to work on, speak with her about it directly.. Give her solid examples.. have her come up with solutions..
TRY really hard to take 2 steps back and stay there.. This is not worth all of your anger.. and frustrations and blame.. This is about a 12 year old girl, being a real 12 year old.. This is what they do.. Assist her, but do not take over her life.. She needs to be able to speak up for herself..
FYI, Our daughter was also an amazing student . graduated with honors, National Merit Scholar..
Once she was in 6th grade.. I NEVER went to the teachers with any concern, unless our daughter had spoken to them first. If she got a low grade, I would ask her.. "Did you do your best?" If she said yes.. fine.. If not, I would ask her "What are you going to do about it?" and then if she needed my help or me going to the teacher with her, she would just ask..
Otherwise we left it alone.. She just graduated from College out of state, with 2 degrees.. She is able to handle whatever comes her way and still knows, if she needs our help, all she has to do is ask.
If you want your child to go to a school that treats her like a mature person she needs to behave like one.
It is your choice whether to remove her from the school but taking the fish back to the small pond isn't going to prepare here for when she must go to the big pond and be the little fish, ya know?
This is all on her, just like in a few years it will be all on her!
First, it is possible your DD didn't get recognition simply because there were other students more deserving. Not everything is academic related, and if she comes across as a know it all (I have one of those) then she may be seen as having an attitude. That doesn't mean she has behavior issue's. As for changing districts, all districts have problems, all schools handle things differently. What I am really hearing is a bunch of hurt feeling when they shouldn't be. These things happen in real life, she either learns how to deal with the, (obvious guidance) or she throws a pity party.
My goodness, the next time my kids gripe at me about being too hard on them, or being too much "in their business" I'm going to show them your post!
Sue H said it perfectly.
And don't change schools. I can promise that you will be WAY more disappointed in a lower level environment.
Wow, that was a long one but I did read it all. I think you are overreacting. We all want our kids to be near perfect, and it sounds like your daughter is, but you want perfection, and no one is capable of that. And not every kid can get recognized either, someone has to be the winner, and someone has to be the loser. And that doesn't mean your daughter is a loser either, don't take it that way. And you should accept the grades that your daughter earned too, even if they weren't perfect, they were still good.
My short anwer is if over all you are happy with this school, then stay.
Long answer.I was with you until you went to the VP-- that sounded a little drastic.I owuld have tried the teacher again.
I do have to say I may have missed a little bit about her walking past him and the part about the teacher having the folder. wHat does she have to say about why she didn't pursue correctign this grade??? Has she had a whole year of not understanding this teachers policiies? Does she understand the information now?
I think you just need to be very careful about what social lessons you want her to learn, Standing up for herself, Inititive to correct her work, not blowing off the end of the year, maybe some unresolved grief, maybe some thing else is going on. not sure how to make that happen,
I mean this nicely, I know i only know part of the story and the part I "heard" is colored from my own experiences, But i was getting a subltle feeling from your post that the grade was more important than your daughter. So just be aware that one person out there felt a smidge of that --again colored by my own perspective. and maybe make sure that she knows that in wanting what is bests for her that you really do love and care about HER First.
Wow. Yes, I'd say you over-reacted and are way too involved with calling teachers and vice principals. If the paper didn't originally earn an A, then it wasn't an A paper when it was turned in and you were arguing over a "do over.". The rest sounds largely like the word of your daughter vs the word of the teacher. One B wouldn't have been the end of the world and may have taught your daughter that there's value in appearance of a positive attitude. In the real world, you can do a stellar job but not have that extra "oomph" of a smile on your face and a passion for the job, and it's the difference in a promotion, a raise, or an exceptional performance review. Attitude does matter.
I see you care about your daughter, but don't focus so much on the grades! Really, they don't matter as much in the long run. NO ONE has EVER asked me what grades I got in 6th grade! Seriously, it doesn't matter that much!
What's important is what your daughter is actually learning. That's what you should pick your school based on!
Since 6th grade is not high school, it seems to be a bit of an overreaction. You could look at it two ways - this is the teacher's fault though your daughter likely still had some part in it. Will this be the only time something is kind of unfair in life? Will she never has a boss who favors a coworker bc the boss just likes the coworker better? Is there a lesson to learn from this? ie: sometimes things are just annoying but maybe could be prevented next time? Or - it really is mainly your daughter's fault and she messed up. Should you rescue her or will she be more focused next time? To be honest, both ways to look at it indicate to me it's mainly a learning experience. In addition, it doesn't seem worth making a big deal at school over and getting that "pain in the neck" familiy reputation. You already went to the VP. I wouldn't do more. And if this isn't private school with high tuition, I'd weigh the cons of your local public against this one. Likely this is the better of your options unless you go private and even then likely things won't be perfect.
Wow! You're right your daughter is not blameless and I feel 6th grade is plenty old enough to take responsibility for your own actions. Even if that means getting a B on your report card!! As far as sending your daughter to a different school I think you should talk to her. See where she stands on all of this her answer may surprise you.
And please remember this IS 6th grade, sounds like she's under quite a bit of pressure for such a young girl.
Wow. confusing and a bit crazy...
Well, I know that deaths are not always excuses out of school, unfortunately. I dealt with both my grandparents passing and was not excused out of anything- work or college. Maybe this will be a lesson to her that she doesn't know it all. Maybe her and her teacher did not like each other, as you suggested, but she still needs to respect him as a teacher. By 6th grade, she should be able to stay on top of things. Being in 6th grade, grades might drop and she might not be into school as much as she used to be or should be. If she has a tough teacher, she needs to work harder and keep her grades up. I learned all these lessons as well, just like everyone else either in school or in the workplace. I do think it is a bit of an overreaction, but if you want that grade then you get it! Let her know that she needs to stay on top of things. You don't want to team up with her and get mad at the teacher for your daughter not having the good grade.
You do know that some of the smartest people in the world recieved d's and f's in school! Some didn't even graduate!
Those numbers mean nothing
But I do agree that the teacher should not have taken back their word...and should not have made an excuse about your daughters attitude
First of all your daughter is in 6th grade. This is when their minds and bodies are completely out of tune... It's not their fault - it is just part of puberty. Asking a 6th grader to stay on top of grades is crazy! They try, but the end of the year is busy with fun things, exams, and warm weather which makes brain cells stop functioning...
The teacher obviously doesn't like your daughter and has issues. I don't think he really wanted to re-grade that paper, so he figured he'd tell you one thing and her another... Your daughter insisted that the teacher had the folder and he did! What more evidence do you want?? The teacher is the problem, not your kid!!!
That said, don't punish her for being a kid!
If she likes the school, keep her there. If she doesn't want to be there, take her out. The child got As like you expected. She dropped one grade, but managed to pull it up with the final -- relax!
Besides, you said that the grades were posted over the weekend... I think my kids had better things to do over the long weekend than to check their grades, thankyouverymuch!
Cut the kid some slack!
LBC
wow. i think you're setting her up to hate school. is there a reason she can not get a high B+? if it is to stay in this school I understand but if thats not a requirement I'd say breathe. its the end of the year. I don't see why a kid should get punnished ecspecialyl since she ended up with an A
I do love the way you care; my dad who was a guidance counselor who cared about other kids grades would say to me, "am I supposed to care about your grades?" They were not his grades. I always felt that my parents didn't care and never followed up on my grades; they felt that is wasn't their responsibility. I always felt as a kid if they don't care, why should I. I hope this helps you; however, a B+ is a wonderful thing. I'm glad you followed up. Your daughter knows that you care and that she should be held accountable. I never felt that way as a kid. Like a said a B is good but you want her to be held to a higher standard and to succeed in life. My father used to say the same thing that this successful person got D's and F's or this person is billionaire w/a B and chewed pencils. Not talking about his students but people he went to school with when he was younger.
I do agree w/others that you should breathe but as a parent we want our children to be successful and do better than we did. Congratulations on your daughter's succuss. She is a great student.
About what? more info in you tag line would REALLY help.
You're not overreacting-the teachers are morons and your daughter is on to them-you may want to gently remind them that they work for you-it's that whole pesky tax thing-and they better do their job, which includes working with children who suffer losses and whose attitudes change from time to time-believe me, this is not unusual-good luck!
