Hi parents,
I want to ask a question on here because when I have asked it elsewhere, I have received mixed answers.
A little background: I have 3 and 6 year olds and a large dog. Currently we live in a house, with a separate garage on a 18,000 sq. ft lot. When the dog needs to go out we just let him out (it's gated). Sometimes when the kids are asleep (or watching TV) we will take care of tasks around the yard. Which means we are not inside the house. We have a monitor in their room. Sometimes when my husband is home alone with them (at night- they are asleep) he will be building something in the garage for a period of time. This seems fine to me with the monitor on.
Our house is being sold and we are moving to an upscale apartment complex for the time being. The reason I say upscale is because I want you to know that the other apartment dwellers are not the riff/raff kind. The apartments are very expensive to lease and you have to have excellent credit and proof of good income. I'm not trying to be snooty- just saying that the building in and of itself is very safe (which was a very big factor in choosing it). You cannot even push a button in the elevator without a key fob. The other great thing is that there is a place on the ground floor to let your dogs out to go potty.
Here is my question: I work away from home (as does my husband). He is not usually home until late. In the afternoon, after I pick up the kids from school, we will need to go to the apartment (on the 3rd floor) and immediately the dog will need to be taken out. He will have been inside most of the day, most likely. I know my children: they will be exhausted and hungry from their long day (they are in school/care from 8:30-4:30). They will want to come inside, grab a snack and watch TV, read a book or play with legos. I will need to take the dog to go potty. If I have the monitor with me (I don't know yet if it will reach) and the doors locked- is it ok to take the dog down two floors and let him out without having to drag both kids with me? Is this considered "at home" since it's in the same building? I imagine if I tried to measure the distance that it is LESS distance than it is from our current house to the garage…. and yet that has never been an issue.
In searching online some people have very strong opinions about this--- but it usually pertains to babies.
My kids aren't babies. My six year old is very independent. Obviously my 3 year old needs supervision but he is earning more independence.
When I asked my husband he says "of course!" … if we want to go down to the lobby and have a drink (some nights when they are asleep), he doesn't see anything wrong with that either- as long as we have the monitor and it reaches. When I asked a friend --- a mom of 4--- she said "Of course!" She often leaves her 5 and 7 year olds at home watching a video while she takes a walk around the block with the dog (and baby).
What would you do? This little issue is stressing me out about apartment living, because if I can't let the dog out without dragging two tired kids (and a Hyper dog) to a dog potty area, it's going to be a stressful couple of months.
additionally, there will be times when either myself or my husband is not home at night, the kids will be asleep, and the one left with them will have to take the dog to potty before bed...
What would you do in this situation?
Thank you to everyone that responded in a nice way. It never ceases to amaze me that over a completely un-dramatic question (what would you do) mamapedia moms can get SO judgmental. I merely asked you a question because I wondered what you think. I didn't say WHAT I'm doing or what I will do. As for the bit with the drinks in the lobby- my husband seems to think that is ok but I would't be comfortable doing that. I never said that I was. And it's not a bar. More of a common room that people gather to have a glass of wine around the fire and shoot a game of pool. But still, I wouldn't be comfortable doing this and I told him that.
Additionally- we are not talking about walking the dog, here. We are talking about 4-5 minutes. Walk dog down the stairs. Say "pee" --- dog pees (he goes on command), and walk back upstairs. There is no walking around the block- I wouldn't even consider that. The dog run is IN the building--- within the grounds.
I planned to have the entire living area viewable on my iPhone if the monitor didn't stretch- wasn't just going to be the bedroom.
But I see that for most people the concern isn't the distance (i would still be ON the property) but that it is two floors up…. That is definitely something good to think about -- and something new for me since I've never lived in an apartment with kids.
And by the way- getting rid of the dog is a ridiculous suggestion-- he's a part of our family! Additionally, I know it will be a change for him, but we go for a very long run every morning together and it usually exhausts him for the rest of the day.
Anyways, thanks for all your helpful suggestions.
I wouldn't do it. Remeber Madeleine McCann?
I also think it is crazy to leave a 3 yo and 6 yo alone so you can socialize/drink in the lobby, I don't care how nice the apartment is. What would you do if there was a fire or more important, what would the kids do if there was a fire?
If it was say a 9 and a 6 year old I would say go for it, but a 3 year old? That is too young. It only takes a moment for a baby that young to climb on something, pull something over, or any number of things, and a 6 year old is way too young to monitor the younger child. I would take the kids with me and if they whined they would just have to get over it.
I try very hard not to helicopter, but even I wouldn't. Things can happen very quickly even when you are home, but can be far worse when you're not. I would definitely not trust a six-year-old to monitor a three-year-old. It's not even about potential kidnapping ... it's about what they can do unsupervised. They're still both very young.
I would just tough it out and do the right thing, taking the kids with you. An alternative would be to hire someone to handle the potty trips. Perhaps there's a teen in the building looking to make a little extra money who can do an early and late evening trip out?
If you can afford an "upscale apartment" you can probably swing paying someone to walk your dog once a day. I understand the temptation to leave them in front of the TV and take the dog out but it's not worth it. Definitely not worth having a drink in the lobby. I imagine it would be pretty easy to find a teenager in your building that would get home mid afternoon that would love to make a few bucks.
Nope. Get someone to walk dog during the day. I am sure there are dog walkers available if this is an upscale place. I am sure other people have dogs that need to go out.
Home alone is home alone. Sorry. Any neighbor who sees you leave them would be totally within reason to complain... and may even call CPS if they're worried.
A monitor is only going to let you know what has happened (if it happens to make a sound) not make you miraculously able to get there and stop it when you're an elevator ride away.
The kids might WANT to go plop down in front of tv after a long day, but they will NEED to ride back down with you to let the dog out...
Really though, why not pay a teenaged neighbor to let the dog out when she gets home from school? That way maybe the dog potty can wait until after snack if it's that critical.
Also... for night times, you may need to invest in one of those indoor dog pee spots (they sell them for apartments and for super cold temps when it's just too cold for dogs to be safe going outside). It'll be one more thing for you to deal with cleaning, daily, but probably worth it if you're that opposed to taking your kids downstairs... something like this http://www.amazon.com/UGODOG-Indoor-Dog-Potty/dp/B00152R5...
Hope this helps.
During this time of transition for you or if you plan to stay at the upscale apartment forever... You both work, you have 2 active children and a large "hyper" dog. The dog is accustomed to a large yard and freedom so expect some type if rebellion from the dog when he/she will now be cooped up
in an apartment.
What dog wouldn't be hyper after staying home alone all day? Much less alone in a confined space when they are accustomed to more space?
Hire a pet sitter to relieve you during the day and allow this dog some much needed attention and care.
When you are home, either you or hubby take the dog out for potty time and exercise.
Do not leave your children in a 3rd floor apt with no access to help if needed. Too many things can happen, especially at those ages. Even if your monitor reaches, do you really think you could get there fast enough in case of fire, choking, home invasion, etc?? NO
As for going to the lobby for drinks.... Go for it as long as you have a responsible sitter watching your children. If not, have your happy hour at home when your children are safely tucked into bed.
Don't take chances when you don't have to. Children are too important.
Eta: as I posted your SWH appeared. No one here is being judgmental. You asked for opinions and got them. Just because you don't like some opinions does not constitute judgment against you. Chill
In that instance, I would simply ask yourself the question:
If you heard an intruder in your home with your children over the monitor, could you make it back inside, up two flights of stairs and into your apartment before the intruder could make it to the other stairs or the elevator or into another apartment with your children?
The answer is realistically no, so that's my answer also.
Rent cost or credit checks do not guarantee good people. And if this was going to become part of your nightly routine, all someone would have to do is observe you and wait for their moment.
Oh, and if I was sitting at the bar with you and your baby-monitor, I'd call CPS on you myself.
No, I would not leave a 3 and 6 year old alone. They are still babies.
Bring a small snack with you when you pick them up from school - they can eat it in the car, then you all three get the dog and take him out. Make this a new routine for your new home. They will adjust and be fine.
As for having a sitter take the dog out while the kids are sleeping - um, no. Take the dog out before the kids go to bed. Take the dog out when you get home.
Elementary my dear. One doesn't leave small children home alone.
I wouldn't leave my kids at home, unattended, to go take the dog out.
Hire a pet sitter.
The dog is being cooped up in an apartment all day.
It does not matter how "independent" a child is. Independence does NOT mean... that they are mature or rational or have perfect deductive and inductive and logical reasoning per situations.
And a 6 year old, cannot babysit a 3 year old.
In a split second, an accident can happen.
Once, in a split second, I saw a girl slip and fall, and hit her head on the concrete ground. RIGHT in front of me. It happened so fast, even I, an adult, could not stop it from happening.
Hire a Pet Sitter or pet walker.
No, take the kids w/you right when you get home to take the dog out to pee. They can eat a snack while you all go out to take the dog to pee.
Then they can go in and relax/do homework/rest/eat etc.
Oh and I would never leave them alone to go downstairs to have a drink.
Remember that Madeline story where the parents left her alone asleep to go down to the close bar to have drink. She was kidnapped from their room & never heard from again. Not worth the risk for a drink. Have a drink together in your apartment while they are safely w/in distance in their rooms sleeping while you rest/relax in the living room right there.
Remember it's never worth the risk.
The dog/pee issue should be easy to handle.
I would hire someone to come take my dog for a walk during the day.
I would not leave a 3 and 6 year old in a home alone. Even for 15 minutes.
Simple answer: NO!
The furthest I'll go when my children are alone in the house is the porch or the yard. And that's only when they're asleep.
Have you ever watched the movie Look Who's Talking Too? The children are left alone in an upstairs apartment by their irresponsible uncle. A fire starts. In the movie the children make it out via the elevator. In reality, those babies would have died. :(
Sitting in a lobby drinking is an irresponsible choice on your part. So is walking the dog while leaving the kids alone. I mean, what would you do, realistically, if a crisis occurred? Do you honestly think the baby monitor is going to save the day? What if it stops working?
And FYI - There are plenty of "bad apples" with money and good credit.
Your easiest solution is either A) get rid of the dog or B) hire a dog walker.
In this situation,I would look into the doggy daycare/boarding places in your area. The dog could play all day and it would just be a temporary expense. At least maybe hire a dog walker during the day or a teenager after school. I would feel comfortable stepping out only if I were on the first floor.
My oldest child is about to be 11. I don't even leave her in the car so I can run in and pay for gas if need be. I always take all 5 of my kids out of the car if I have to get out of the car or if I have to go outside. It may not always be the most convenient thing to do but I couldn't imagine leaving my children alone like that. Even for ten minutes. Maybe I'm paranoid but in this day and age I feel you have to be. My answer for you would be that this isn't acceptable.
However, on the other hand, I have a friend who also has 5 kids and she leaves her kids alone for a lot of things. Her oldest is 12 tho.
I personally am not comfortable with this.
I can't help but think about little Madeleine Mccann.
Child molesters and child killers come from all socioeconomic statuses. A Du Pont heir was just exposed as a baby rapist. The difference between the riff raff in the downscale apartment building and the predators in your upscale apartment building: the former use public defenders, the latter can afford expensive defense attorneys and win the sympathy of judges.
I worry the most about fire. My girl is 8 and I would worry about a two minute milk run to the bodega next to our building without her. There is always the chance of a fire and you would not be allowed to re-enter the building or couldn't make it up smoke-filled stairs between the lobby and your apartment. Would you children know what to do if the fire alarm sounded? Can they exit the building safely on their own? If they tried to exit and couldn't, would they know to open a window and hang a towel to signal they need rescue? Are they physically able to open the window?
I have read through your answers and seems I am in the minority. Personally I am thinking you would be fine. Set the kids up with a safe snack, turn on the TV and let them relax and watch one of their favorite shows. If you have a monitor that is AWESOME. If not then you could use cellphones or something along those lines so that you could talk to the kids while you were letting the dog out.
If we constantly worry about all of the "what-ifs" we will never get through life. The chances of something horrible happening are actually, realistically pretty small.
As far as the suggestion to get rid of the dog - anyone who suggests such a thing should NEVER have a pet period, they are not disposable.
I do think it is funny that everyone is concerned that this dog is never going to get any excercise. I am guessing that you are planning on walking your dog and giving him/her plenty of play time on the weekends. It also sounds like this is a temporary situation.
As long as your 6 year old is comfortable with the situation and you feel that he/she is mature enough to handle it for the 10 minutes you are going to be out of sight, I am thinking that you should be fine. :-)
I wouldn't do it... in your home, you are fairly certain that no random idiot is gonna start a kitchen fire or fall asleep with a candle burning or a cat's not gonna knock over a lamp, etc. in an apartment, what if something just like that happens on the first or second floor while you're our for "just a minute" - you're not gonna be able to get back upstairs to get to your kids. they can suck it up and go out to walk the dog with you. get an umbrella stroller and have your 6yo push your 3yo in it if necessary. make it part of their "daily chores". and your dog needs WAY more than a "quick potty" after being cooped up ALL DAY LONG, he needs a nice long walk/run. since you're clearly advertising that your family is well off, use some of those funds to hire a thoroughly checked out dog sitter and have them come in once a day around noon to spend 30 minutes walking/running the dog. I'm afraid you're gonna end up with a miserable stressed out dog otherwise. good luck!
i would.
especially since you have a monitor!
i'd go over safety rules with the kids, and with the 3 year old make very sure he was in a safe place, and i'd take the dog out.
yes, there's a risk involved. but teeny tiny risks don't faze me. this would fall under 'making my life manageable' and i'd make it happen.
khairete
S.
My kids are much older and I've only recently started walking our dog in a circle around our house and leaving the kids. What worries me most is choking... What about a dog walker? Sounds like this is a temporary thing and that's a long time for a dog to be home alone. Could solve two problems. Less immediate need to dog to go out when you get home and give the poor dog a break during the long day.
I would probably leave them inside watching a show. BUT, I wouldn't leave them with any food. Especially the 3 year old. I had to do the heimleich on my son when he was 3.
My eldest is 11 1/2 and I have left him home by himself multiple times. He has a phone, he knows not to answer the door, he knows not to cook, he knows not to eat. My middle is 8 and I have left him a few times, but only with my older son.
IF, God forbid, something happens to your 3 year old, then is your 6 year old going to feel like he was responsable for whatever befell your 3 year old? Example- My cousin is married to a fabulous woman. I love her. She is inspirational, kind, generous, just a fantastic person. When she was little, 2 (?) she was outside with her older brother and he was lifting weights. Somehow she got under him while he was lifting and he dropped the weights on her. She is paralyzed. I don't know this man, but I am sure that as a young man he felt LOTS of guilt for what happened. Even though it was an accident!
L.
if you can afford the "upscale" property, then hire someone to come in and take care of the dog for you during the day. This is going to be a HUGE change for him and a tad unfair, if you ask me.
My dog stressed when I was gone for 3 weeks to take care of my mom before she died. When I came home (yes, my husband and kids were here - but **I** the mommy!!!) he was mad and happy ...couldn't decide which to do first - tell me he missed me and telling me that I was gone too long...yes...my dog talks...it's hilarious...
Any way - hire someone to come in and take the dog for walks during the day.
I don't like leaving my kids in my car when I run into the store for 5 minutes....and that young? I don't think I'd be comfortable with leaving them alone at all. Unfamiliar surroundings....things happen in the blink of an eye...
Definitely no.
I get that you are trying to find a compromise between being a good mom and a good pet owner... But I would NEVER leave a 3 year old without responsible supervision... And a 6 year old definitely doesn't qualify. Heck, I was barely willing to shower if there was no one around to supervise my DD when she was 3... She got to watch cartons in my room.
The thing is, that no matter how upscale or secure the building is there are soooo many things that could happen, and kids that young just don't have the maturity to know how to handle it. Fires, burglary, molestation (ESPECIALLY if you have a routine that you leave your children unattended for a set amount of time at a certain time of day...) no matter how thoroughly a background is checked, nothing is going to pop unless the person has been caught first. You have no clue who is going to be in that building with you.
It's a hassle, but I would take the kids with me. Maybe call it play time, where they can ride their bikes for a while. I always played outside after school. It's not so exhausting when you are having fun. Maybe there is a park nearby you could walk to, where they can play for a few minutes. Having a fun destination would likely make them more willing to go.
I DEFINITELY wouldn't leave hem at night to hang out in the lobby. If I wanted a few drinks, I would drink them in my house or hire a babysitter to go out... Even if just to the lobby.
i agree with the poster who suggested you need a dog sitter, even if it is someone who comes once or twice while you are gone. that way you don't have to rush taking the dog out. i also agree with others who suggested you and the two kids go outside together. it takes 4-5 minutes so even if they are cranky, better to be safe than sorry. i still haven't left my 9 year olds alone ever. even for a couple of minutes, and i have cameras which i can view live on my phone.
Whether or not I would do this would depend on how mature my 6 yo is, how well they get along as well as how child proof my apartment is. If there are no hazards and you would only be gone 5-10 minutes with access via a monitor I might give it a try. Can you give them a snack and see that they're interested in a tv program or a movie?
I would first try to find a 10 yo or older child to take the dog out for you. Pay them a small amount.
I would only regularly leave them aloneas a last resort. When they are alone everyday they will begin to test what they can do. Staying in front of the TV will become boring.
I would consider giving them a snack in the car and take them with you. I would work on training the dog to be obedient even when excited. After all we expect our children to always obey. Why not the dog?
Would you consider hiring a dog walker or a doggy daycare.
Even if you did not have kids, I do not think keeping a dog (especially a large one) inside all day is a good idea.
edit: Do you have any friends who can watch your kids or know of any families in the area with older kids (13 year old girl for example) who can sit with your children while you walk the dog? Or Have the hypothetical 13 year old walk your dog.
I have a 5 yr old I will leave in another part of the house or allow to be outside for a short time if I can see her. But she's done things like woken up screaming from a nightmare or nearly stabbed herself in the eye during breakfast (when I was in the shower). So my vote is that if at all possible you should not leave them home alone and unsupervised. Your friend who walks around the block is taking a big risk with her kids that I personally would not. You can explain to them that the dog needs to potty and then you all go out for just a little while to let the dog pee. At night, perhaps make it part of a nighttime walk just before bed, with the kids. You say this is temporary, so hopefully everyone can adjust to the schedule for the duration. At the very very least, take the 3 yr old with you. If there is a place on the ground floor to let the dog out, the kid can come along in his pjs.
ETA: I like the idea of a dog walker. Then you can all come home and relax a bit.
I would take the kids with me. I am inherently mistrustful of apartment living. I once lived in a nice apartment with a little old lady living next door. She broke into my apartment one morning when she thought I wasn't there and when I confronted her she made a statement that led me to believe that she routinely did so. Who knew she had lock picking skills? Upscale means nothing...crappy people don't just live in the slums.
I have a 6 year old and a newly turned 4 year old. I own my house. I do take my dogs out without the children. The younger one stands at the door and watches until we get back in or she comes with me.
I wouldn't want to leave a three-year-old and a six-year-old alone to take Rover out to answer the call of nature for five minutes, much less to walk him for twenty minutes. Lots of things can happen in five minutes. I wouldn't go down to the lobby and get a drink, either. (Monitors are great, but where I live, if you leave young children alone and leave the *property*, you may get in trouble with the law.)
Yes, you're going to have a stressful time. So will the dog. This is where helpers come in handy. Do you know a reliable teenager who lives near your apartment - someone whose family you also know - who would love to earn some money by taking Rover out for potty and for a walk two or three times a day? If not, there are people who do just this as their business - and it would be a worthwhile investment for your family life if you hired one of them for the duration..
I'd take the kids with me. Make it part of your routine. Before our dog passed, it was our 5 year old's job to let her out when we got home from school. (now she's 7 and it's her job to feed the fish when we get home.) If we'd lived in an apartment, she would have been the one holding the leash, probably. 5 extra minutes before they can be fed is not going to make a huge difference. If you need to, give them a small snack in the car on the way home, fruit snacks or something to tide them over.
I'm all for parenting your kids based on their maturity level and not their age, but leaving kids that age alone in an apartment while you go floors away is asking for trouble. If you were staying on the same floor, like to run to a garbage shoot or something, that would probably be fine. But if you're out of sight of the front door, I'd say it's not worth the risk.
I can't think of an apartment that would take a large dog.
But I suppose some might exist.
No way would I leave kids that age alone.
Hire a dog walker or get a baby sitter to watch the kids for when you need to walk the dog.
A six-year-old can watch a three-year-old long enough for the dog to relieve himself.
What I don't get is why you would keep a large dog in an apartment where he doesn't have a yard to play in.
I have dogs and they need EXCERCISE !! It's so important !
If you can afford a beautiful apt, then, spend a few dollars on the beautiful dog (who is part of the family) and have a dog walker take the doggie on a 15 minute walk. And, then walk the dog on your own on the weekends !
I just read that the dog is hyper---More the reason to have a dog walker !
If you are taking the dog out at 8 am, then, have the walker come around lunch time ! Maybe just the company of a walker for 15 minutes a day, with help with the dog's adjustment to a new place. I vote for a run and a small walk around lunch !
My concern is that they can't get in the elevator without a key fob. Can they access the stairs? Can your three year old physically open the door, or is it too heavy? What if there was an emergency and they couldn't get to you?
I think it's probably fine, since you'll still be within the grounds of the apartment building. I would just make absolutely sure that your children can get to you if they need to. Having the monitor isn't enough, since it will be in the bedroom but the kids will be in the living room or kitchen. They absolutely have to be able to run downstairs if needed.
I think it would be fine. You know your kids. You are a wonderful person for keeping you commitment to your fuzzy child. Anyone who suggests getting rid of a family member should never have kids or pets. People take out the trash or take a shower without bring their kids, so I thing taking your dog to pee for a few minutes is fine. We travel 2 days by car every year instead of 4 hours by plane, just so our fuzzy child (dog) can be comfortable. Good luck.
