Proper Discipline

fyi - I have not read the other responses...but here are my thoughts...

Four is still quite young to be hanging out "unsupervised" -whether intentionally or not. Obviously from your post, neither time was "intentional". I would have my eyes on him all of the time, unless he is in the house or in a fenced in yard (and he is checked on frequently and unable to leave). Maybe I am a little conservative, but those little guys can move fast...and they don't have the best judgement (strangers, cars, getting lost, dangerous situations, easily distracted, little sense of time, etc).

I would talk to him about "big boy" privileges...like getting to play with his friends while Mommy talks to her friends. If he is not big enough to know that he always needs to stay where he can see you (and vice versa), he doesn't get that privilege. It will be harder on you, because then you have to make him stand right by you while you talk to your friends (or go home), but a couple of times doing that and he will probably know how to act like a big boy so that he can play nearby. He should have the privileges once he is responsible enough to handle them.

As for sneaking out of the house... again, leaving the house by yourself is a big kid privilege. He is not old enough for that yet. If he is not going to follow the rules, you have to take away a similar privilege. For example, "if you are not going to ask Mommy before opening the front door and leaving, you are not responsible enough to open the front door and go out on your own. Mommy will have to keep the door locked (lock inaccessible to him) and walk you out." Again, this is harder for you than him...but you have to stick to your guns. You may feel like you are treating him like a 2 or 3 year old, but until he follows the rules and shows responsibility, he should not get big kid privileges.

Responsibility earns privileges.

Ideally, he should think he's going to get in trouble and then you talk to him and maybe cry instead. It's hard to talk to him about it so far after the fact.

Spankings won't do a thing - esp for a boy. They tend to think of it as the cost of getting to do what they want.

Talk to him. Don't let the rule "cuz mom said so". Tell him why. and Tell him that you love him soooo sooo much.

B.,
I'm going to agree with your thinking of good discipline is to not be able to go outside if he can't follow the rules for outside. It is a natural consequence. I'm a child therapist that works with children and their parents everyday. One of the best things I have seen work with parents and their children is to give them choices. Sit him down and explain that it's not safe for him to go somewhere where you don't know where he is, so the rule in the house will be, "If you choose to go to a friends house without asking for permission, you choose not to go to the friends house that day. If you choose to ask permission, you choose to have the possibility to go (you have to make that work, he probably can't just go whenever he wants). Then you say, "You get to choose." By reframing the way you say it, and particularly using the word choose a lot, you change their mind frame to begin to ponder their choices. Then in the future, the rule is set. You don't need to get upset with him if he breaks the rule. You simply say, "I see that you chose not to play at your friends house today." They learn very quickly that it's not that mom isn't letting them go to their friends, but that they are choosing not to go to their friends house. He can still go outside into your yard if you want, just not to a friends house because he didn't ask to go there. That's what I meant above by a natural consequence. It follows the action. Hope that explanation makes sense.

My son started doing the similar disappearing act recently! (He's 5). He would go out to play and end up at a friends house without telling us. We live in a large apartment complex and sometimes the "friend" is a new kid who moved in and that's a lot of doors to knock on. We've actually gotten the police involved a couple of times!

The last time he didn't tell me where he was going, the police were called. He came home just after the police got here, and the officer talked to my son - that made an impression. But I still made him stay inside for a week. No playing with friends, no bike, nothing. He kept asking to go outside, and I would remind him he couldn't because he didn't tell me where he was going. I also told grandma when she was babysitting that week that he couldn't go outside, and why, within his hearing (so he knew they knew and wouldn't try to weasel out of it). For a 4-year-old, maybe 4-5 days is long enough.

I commend you for not spanking. Kids tend to associate corporeal punishment more with the punisher and less with their behavior. It's much better to use logical consequences - and keeping him in after he disappears is a logical consequence. Same with if he sneaks over to a friend's house. (I talked to my son's friends' parents and let them know he wasn't telling me where he was and to please have him call me, or they call me, just so I knew - and to not trust him if he said I knew.) Bring him home right away and then for that day (and maybe the next) he stays inside.
You're going to feel bad making him stay in. It's not always going to be easy. Sometimes my son would say "I hate having to stay inside" and I would tell him "I know. Me too. But the rule is you have to tell me where you're going. When you don't, you have to stay inside." Just be very calm about it and don't get into discussions, arguments, or negotiations over it. This is the rule, this is the consequence, end of discussion.

Stay firm and consistant and he will get it. It could take a while, but if you follow through EVERY time, he'll get it.

He was clearly distressed that his little hiding game got out of control, and he was embarassed, and afraid. I think that's punishment enough. (I'm not saying that you said he needed punishment -- I'm just saying that he has already received punishment -- all that distress could not have been pleasant for him.)

He's just a little tiny guy with a little tiny brain. He's got the whole world ahead of him to learn and explore, and that will include mistakes, because what are the odds that a little guy will consistently choose the right thing to do? He won't even KNOW the right thing until he tries it out a few times.

He will benefit from your "loving instruction"; he will not benefit from discipline, at this age, in this type of situation. Because spanking or yelling at or punishing the little guy will not teach him what he did wrong and how to make a better choice next time. It will only make him fearful of telling you the truth. So you're on the right track.

B.,

What does spanking teach anyone? Just because it was your parent's choice of "discipline" doesn't make it a good choice. As far as I see, spanking is a release of energy for the parent.

More than worrying about punishment, it sounds like you need to communicate more with your son. The best communication tool is listening. Why does he feel he has to sneak out of your home? It sounds like both of you are having issues with trust. It's time that you express your fears about what could happen to him when he disappears. Help him to understand how much you love him and worry about his safety and then listen to what his fears are.

With my whole heart, C.
Owner of Loving Connections LLC

What is Loving Connection? Sharing my whole heart.

Maybe a day at the park w/him having to sit next to you would help him understand that if he obeys the rules he gets to do the fun stuff. It's a painful lesson for you both (he'll be sad & you'll feel bad) but he's old enough to start understanding consequences of his actions. The next time he sneaks over to the friend's house, have the friend's mom kick him out (tell her to call you & let you know he's there). My son did that once & I was nearly to calling the police point myself-very scary!! When the neighbor & I (he was in the shower & didn't hear my son come inside) found him, neighbor told him he wasn't welcome in his house if he didn't ask me first. I think that did more than me saying anything did-his friend's Dad kicked him out & wouldn't let him come back for the rest of the day.
Get the obnoxious noise alarms-they do nothing but beep horribly loud-and put them on the top of the door (warn hubby to call before he's on his way home so you can turn it off). You'll hear your son leave & if he's like my kids, the noise will stop him dead in his tracks anyway.
Good luck Mom!

B., I am with your mom on this one. I have found it very affective to use spanking when it is a life or death situation that my child(ren) need to never forget the seriousness of the situation. When my oldest was just a little tike he went into the road over and over. I couldn’t get him to stop. Then one day I spanked him. With explaining to him the seriousness of his behavior and the spanking he never did it again. I have done this with each of my children. Spanking because you are angry is using spanking incorrectly. I feel for you in this situation it would be appropriate. This could have easily been a life or death situation. Hope this helps.

Hi B., I also agree with Elizabeth S. At this age, the responsibility lies with Momma to be sure of where he is. He's too young. Good luck!

I don't know, but what if HE didn't know where YOU were? I wouldn't necessarily hide from him, but if you could create a story about a child that lost their mom and talked about it so that he could understand how it feels to loose someone you love, and then how it feels to know that the person hurt you on purpose for fun.... just an idea.

Or go with the positive and make it an issue of trust. When mommy know where you are it builds trust. Put M&Ms in a jar or something good to earn when you know where he is throughout the day (every hour or so). When the jar is filled, you get to go to the zoo or somewhere it's important that you trust him. If he betrays that trust by sneaking out, take a whole handfull of M&Ms out of the jar as punnishment.

Spanking is archaic and does not work. Logical consequences for actions work so the kids learn from their mistakes and not be mad a t you for "disciplining " them. It sounds like he was pretty scared. Also, is a four year old that self aware? Chalk it up to learning experiences for both of you!

Hi B.,
There is a fabulous book called Love and Logic and it really gives good tips on creating and following through on consequences. Our moms had a different experience with us and spanking was just something most people did back in the day. You just have to find his hot buttons and then follow through, follow through, follow through!! If you give him the power of making choices, don't feel guilty when HE makes the wrong ones. Give yourself some grace...you're a good mom :)

My daughter at the same age took her 18 m.o. little brother with her and left the house while I was in the bathroom and went all the way to the end of our street to a friend's house. We had had several incidents of her going out or going visiting without permission before this, and I had given her timeouts, but obviously she did not understand what the big deal was - she just "served her time" and went on merrily doing what she wanted. She was (and is still at age 8) a child who tests limits, and has a hard time accepting them until she has tried to break them a few times. With safety issues, of course, this can't be accepted.

Luckily the friend's mom, not seeing me with my children, immediately marched them back to the house and met me on the street going house to house in a pure panic looking for my kids.

Once I had calmed down enough to speak somewhat rationally, I explained to her how scared I had been. Then I told her some of the possibilities of what could have happened to them. This is one time I didn't worry about whether I was scaring her. I wanted her to understand how serious the situation was. And I told her just how frightened I had been. I cried, she cried, and she finally "got it." A four year old is old enough to understand "I was afraid of losing you forever." Once I made her understand that this was a serious safety issue I got total compliance. She has never in the four years since failed to ask before going somewhere, and has helped teach her little brother the importance of doing so.

well he's 4 and he knew better, and didn't see fit to come out of hiding until after you had been looking for him for quite a while. I'm with your mom, I would have spanked him for willfully being disobeidient. He knew you would be mad. Don't feel guilty about keeping him inside, he really does deserve at least that as a consequence. As to having older girls, every child is different and what one responds to discipline wise is always going to be different than what your other children respond to. My discipline has always been based on what behavoir needs correcting, which is how my mom did it for the 5 of us, and yes sometimes a swat is called for.

I think since this has happened before that he needs to hear from another adult the dangers of doing what he is doing. Maybe take him to the police station and have a police officer talk to him and explain how his actions could possibly cause worse things to happen. If you personally know a police officer or other authority figure, that would work too.

I know it may seem extreme, but this situation is close to extreme in itself. Having a 4 year old myself, along with other children, I definitely believe a child this age is able to understand why it's wrong. Good luck!

Have a GREAT day!

S.

I just wanted to second the wonderful advice given by Elizabeth S.

B.,

There are not many spanking offenses. I spanked my son a total of four times while he was growing up. This is one of them.

I sense a lot of your motivation to punish your son is because it took you so long to find him, that made you panic, the adrenaline started to pump and you reacted in anger by the time you caught him. It's not about our emotions as a parent, it's about teaching a child discipline and responsibility.

Before he leaves the house say "Before you leave I want to issue you a challenge. If you can promise me you will not ____ of go to ____'s house and you'll be home by ____ then you will be rewarded with ____. Please remember this. If you break these rules, which are ___, _____, ____ then you will be punished. Your punishment will be ______ so please remember that before you break the rules."

Give him a hug, kiss, and compliment then say "I'm excited for you to come home so we can have your reward of _____ together. I love you! Have fun!"

Setting the rules clear in his mind and repeating them several times will re-enforce good behavior. He knows the exact punishment before he receives it. There will be no surprises. He will learn cause and effect and see you being consistent in your parenting style. If he knows his punishment and reward before he makes the choice, he will have no reason to disobey.

You will also enjoy:

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K.

Under his own admission: he knew he would be in trouble so he had hidden in the basement. Because of this, he is definitely old enough to know better. You need to explain to him that some people are not nice and he could be hurt or taken by someone when he runs off. Explain to him that if you don't know where he went, you don't even know where to start looking if someone bad found him and you couldn't find him.

I agree, that the police officer visit might be helpful. Or maybe at least a little lesson about how police, firemen, etc are supposed to help people -- and there are people who are totally opposite, which is why we need police in the first place...to help deal with the bad people. Also that just because they think they know someone, doesn't mean they are a safe person...so mom needs to know what he is doing.