Questions About Ferber Method

ul.

I'm a huge fan of the Ferber method, used on my 9 month old (now 10 months). When people say they tried Ferber and it didn't work, I wonder if they really followed it through and were consistent, which is key. You can't pick up your baby unless s/he is in physical pain or ill.

My baby was waking up 3 times each night, and would only go back to sleep if I nursed her. The first 3 nights of Ferber were awful and I almost caved, but then miraculously, on the 4th night she slept about 10 hours. Once the night time sleep improved, naps became easier too. Now she takes 2 naps, morning and afternoon. For naps, we don't follow a strict schedule of when she has to go down. We do have a bedtime and we're consistent with that, but for daytime I just watch for her cues, like low energy and a lot of eye rubbing.

So my advice to you is to get the night time routine down first, and the rest will get easier. Maybe you could feed your daughter at times other than right before you expect her to fall sleep. I don't know if you have the revised 2006 edition of the Ferber book, but for naps it says if they're not asleep after half an hour, pick them up and try again later.

I think some people who criticize Ferber don't know what it entails (you don't just leave your baby to cry alone indefinitely--you go in periodically to reassure them). I'm not worried about my baby developing emotional problems from a few nights of Ferberizing because she gets the best of everything and has plenty of love and attention during the day. Good luck, and let me know if you want to discuss further.

Hi J.. I know how hard it is to listen to your baby cry...but it does get better, keep hanging in there. I have one small suggestion...maybe you could wait a little longer in between naps to put her down. You said she goes down for a nap with 90 min. in between? Maybe she is not tired enough and will fight it less if you wait a little longer. This is just a suggestion,she might be really ready after 90 min. You are doing the right thing I did this with my first son at about 9 months and it took about 3 days. But I hated every minute of it, when my husband was home I would leave the house at his bedtime when he would put him to sleep. Such a hard time. Also please try not to get too stressed out and anxious about this. I worried so much about my first son's sleep habits that I feel I missed out on enjoying the time with him. I was always worried about keeping him on the schedule from Baby Wise. I am much less anxious and worried with my second guy who is 10 months (my oldest now 3 1/2) When he misses a nap or has an off day, like we all do. I just say ahh he'll survive we all will let's just hang out and try to have fun. Soo, hang in there but STOP beating yourself up. These days when they are little go to fast to be totally stressed out about their sleep. Lots of LUCK your way. Leah

No one should beat you up about using whatever parenting style you choose. I would never judge your methods. However, my heart goes out to you because during all of this "trying" that you are doing.... you can't possibly be enjoying your baby as fully as you deserve. The best day of my life was when my daughter was a few months old and I stopped trying and started enjoying. Instead of forcing a schedule, I just decided to play with her until she got tired. Oh, it was a wonderful day. The dishes were piling up and I had tons of other things to do, but I ignored it all and truly truly enjoyed myself. I hope you either A) are successful in your Ferberizing or B) find peace in the beautiful unpredictable moments. Good luck.

Hi J.,

We used the Ferber method on our son when he was 9 months old. I was so frustrated and fed up, but after 5 days it worked! He had finally (and has almost every night since then) slept through the night! Hang in there and stick to it like described. :)

I am trying this method myself. It is a challenge because my boyfriend doesn't like to just let him cry. (He is 6 months) My boyfriend will just put him into bed with us. I dont' mind cosleeping right now, but I am worried that once he starts rolling over and everything that he can't sleep with us anymore. Maybe start keeping her up longer between naps. Maybe she isn't tired after 90 minutes anymore. My little guy will go 2 to 2 1/2 hours before getting tired. When it's naptime and he is resistant to sleeping, I have him do his tummy time for 10 to 15 minutes. That usually wears him out enough to be ready for a nap. If you don't like the constant crying of Ferber, you can do modified Ferber. That is what I am doing. You start by putting them down and setting a timer for 10 minutes. If still crying check on baby, pat, soothe, whatever, just DON'T PICK HER UP. Next set for 15 minutes, then 20, etc until she falls asleep. This seems to work a little better for me because I don't have to try and deal with constant crying, and the baby doesn't usuually get so upset that he/she is inconsolable. The one day it took 45 minutes to get him to sleep, the next day it was 20. Hope this helps. Good luck.

Hi J.-
You sound like you are in a similar situation as I was at 5 months - going back to work part time, needed my sleep, and my daughter was IMPOSSIBLE to put to bed. So, yes, I used the Ferber method and it worked. I did read the No Cry Sleep Solution before and decided that our routine would be: play on our bed for however long she liked/read books (this lasts anywhere from 10min-1 hr, I watch for her to rub her eyes,yawn, get very still and stare, tired signs...), get her bath ready with her in my arms (or my husband's arms I should say, he is th e one who puts her down mostly), get her undressed/sing to her, get her bath, get her lotioned/dressed, turn down the lights/put on music, and sit in the rocking chair and give her her last bottle with the lights out. Then we let her scream for a period of about 5 days, the 1st-3rd days were the WORST and then it was less each time. Now she usually falls asleep on the bottle or is okay to put down (we try most of the time to put her down mostly awake), and still we have to let her cry sometimes if something has messed up our schedule. Anyway, this has worked for us and I wanted to be specific about our routine because I think this has really helped signal to her that it is time for bed. As for naps, is your daughter really tired when you put her down? i tried doing what you are doing and it just left me frustrated until a friend asked me this question. Then I just tried to watch my daughter more carefully, which has worked. However, we still have problems with that....But really, maybe you have a baby that needs less sleep? I don't know what you have to get done in a day and if you are alone most of the time with her, I too would want a scheduled break, but maybe just watch signs for tiredness instead of making her go to sleep??? I don't know, it is just so hard.
Long story short, we used Ferber and it worked. I feel like I know how hard this decision is for you and I just want to say, if you think it's the way to go,trust your instinct!

Hi! I LOVE LOVE LOVE Ferber. I did it with both of my sons, who are now 2 and 6 and they sleep like champs. My husband and I seriously thought we were going to divorce over disagreements during these tough times! Trust me when I say, stick with it and you will be so glad you did. You are teaching your child good sleep habits that will benefit her for the rest of her life! As for the naps, that is difficult. Make sure you are spacing them out enough so that she is sleepy at that time. Maybe 90 minutes isn't enough time to be awake before her afternoon nap? Have her watch a baby einstein video or play with her on the floor and stretch it another half hour. It is okay if she goes to sleep while nursing as long as it isn't every single time she goes to sleep. Hang in there, this really does work. The closer you do the program, the faster it works, so try to be strong. you can do it! Email me if you have any questions, I love talking about sleep stuff!

K.

I agree with some of the other people that she's probably not tired enough yet after 90 minutes. My twin boys were probably doing 3 naps a day at 5 months old so were going 2-2 1/2 hours between naps. This is also when I took away their pacifiers (they were getting me up every hour in the night to put it back in their mouths) and let them cry it out. Best decision I ever made. They're 11 months now, do 2 naps a day and usually sleep through. I wouldn't worry about following Ferber to the T, though. I kind of did it my way, what felt right (eg. I would let them fall asleep while breastfeeding sometimes - this didn't seem to screw them up, as long as they were going to sleep on their own sometimes). I think 5 months is a great age to do this because it gets them into good sleep habits at a young age, before they get the attitude. I tried to let my older son cry it out when he was 20 months old and eventually gave up. I found it too hard to do at that age. By the way, I can relate to the husband working long hours. We don't see a heck of a lot of Daddy during the week so all decisions are mine!

Hey J.

I used Ferber's method on both of my kids when they were between 5 and 6 months old. It worked for teaching them to sleep on their own. My only question/suggestion about her naps is, is she ready for a nap when you are trying to put her down? She's 5 months old and her sleep habits will naturally change around this age and she just may not be sleepy. It may be just fine to wait until the next feeding before putting her down. Make sure you are reading her sleepy cues. Tired crying or red eyes, grumpy and not hungry/messy, then she needs a nap. Oh, and on occassion my baby (11 months) will still fall asleep in the rocking chair without my intention of letting it happen and I just pop her in the crib and go on with the night and she has been fine.
You and she will be just fine, no matter what you do with her :)

I would check out Dr. Sears. His methods are very gentle and calming. Here is a link to his webpage on Sleep http://www.askdrsears.com/html/7/T070300.asp.

Im not flaming or trying to make you feel guilt, but please know there is a lot of controversy surrounding the methods used by both Ferber and Ezzo .

We used Ferber with our 5 month old and were SO pleased. Hang in there and definitely don't beat yourself up. You are working to help your daughter sleep well which is a very good thing for both of you.

I have two quick thoughts about the second nap. First is that my understanding of Ferber is that for naps you try for 30 minutes and if they don't fall asleep in that time, the nap is over. You can try again later if they seem sleepy. The second thought is that we nurse before most naps and bedtime still (at 14 months) but just make sure that we wake her up enough afterwards that she is aware that she is in her crib and falls asleep there. Best of luck!

J.,
I myself have used this method (although not at the time realizing there was an actual NAME to it! :) )
It is a bit difficult - but it WORKS. For those who can stand to stick it out. (Usually not more than a week).With my 3 kids (now 5, 4 and 1 1/2) they ALL learned that when we put them in their cribs, it was bedtime, and they accepted that fact. We never had a problem with kids in our bed, or fights at bedtime, it just IS what it is.
I wish you luck and hope that you have as much success as we've had, in as short a time as possible. Remember this - don't let ANYONE tell you if you let your child cry that they'll feel "unloved". That is completly ridiculous. Your child feels your love all day long, and at night when you kiss them and hug them goodnight. What they'll then feel if they need to cry themselves to sleep, is the beginning of a consistent routine that is MUCH easier on both baby and parent(s).
Good luck!!

Hi, J..

First of all -- I've never used Ferber. But I wanted just to say: please, don't beat yourself up over your parenting choices. I wonder, however, how long you tried sticking with all the other methods you say you've tried. I did a lot of research and picked Baby Whisperer for my daughter when she was 2 months old (8+ weeks of her never sleeping during the day UNLESS I was wearing her, screaming anytime I ever put her down in a bouncy seat, in a swing, on the floor, in a co-sleeper, in the crib, etc... AND ONLY sleeping at night ON MY CHEST was *really* wearing me down!). That said, it took another month, at least, of sticking with it & trying to make it work before my daughter began to adapt to an actual routine, so she had a recognizable schedule. And, of course, all children have constantly evolving sleep patterns. ESPECIALLY so young. At 5 months, my daughter was probably awake closer to 2 to sometimes 3 hours at a stretch before she NEEDED a nap. I'm sorry I don't have any advice for you on the Ferber method, but I certainly wish you luck and hope you find success!

Hi J.,
Boy do I feel for you! Sounds similar to the problem I had. Only when my little boy was 3 months-old, he was wonderful when it came to bedtime. He would go down with no problem after his bath, books, and bottle. But naps were another story; up until he was six-months old, I would hold him over my shoulder, or cradle him while he slept during the day. But then he started getting to big to hold, and he wasn't sleeping well like this, but he would not go in his crib, he would just cry. Finally at his 6 month check-up, under STRICT instructions from our Doctor, we had to make him nap in the crib. It was the hardest thing I ever had to do! Generally, 2 hours after waking they are ready for their first nap, then 3 hours after waking from that, they are ready for their second nap at that age. So, we cleared our schedules for a couple weeks and did it. About an hour and a half after he woke up in the morning, I started. We would read books on Mom and Dad's bed, then we would go in his room for his bottle. Then, (even if he was still wide-awake) I put him in his crib, kissed him goodnight and left. It was so awful, the first few times he cried for about 40 mintues, and only slept for 45 min. But I kept at it, I would go back in every 7-8 minutes, and talk to him, dry his tears, and rub his belly. About the 5th or 6th time I would go in I wouldn't even say anything, I just dried his tears, gave him a loving pat, and left. Like I said it was so hard and I know it hurt me more than it did him. I just kept telling myself he was safe in there, and I had to do it for his health. By the end of the first week, I was so amazed! He might cry for 5 or 10 minutes, and sometimes not at all. By the end of the second week we had it down to a "T"!!! He didn't cry AT ALL, and he would sleep anywhere from 1 1/2 to 3 hours each. It was so wonderful for me, and he was much happier when he was awake too. I was very proud of myself for doing it! Now he's 18 months old, and we're dealing with going from 2 to 1 naps a day--a new problem to deal with! Hope this helps!

HI J.. We're an English Pointer family too! (Not to many of us in PA, so nice to meet another one.) Co-sleeping is not an option for us either... we just wake each other up! We use the "No cry sleep solution" and have liked it very much.

Don't beat yourself up about this (and I in no way mean anything negative), but do you think you have realistic expectations about sleep? You don't say what you are expecting, so it is a genuine question. Some kids are not very good nappers (mine, for one) 5 months old isn't very old, esp. if they are still breastfed. I agree that a routine is important, but there are a lot of "2 steps forward, one step back" with sleeping at this point. It must be very hard on you being the sole child care provider most of the time, and I am sure you are nervous about going back to work. I wish you the best of luck.

I haven't tried the Ferber method exactly, but I'd like to respond because you mentioned some Babywise principles. A lot of my friends used Babywise, so I thought I'd give it a try, too. My son is now 9 months old. When he was a tiny infant, I drove myself crazy trying to follow the Babywise schedule. I thought I wasn't doing something right if we had an off day. When I finally gave up the idea of wanting to do everything perfectly, I had a great time with my baby boy! I still fall prey to wanting to be the perfect mom, but I try to remember that when I'm up in the middle of the night (teething!), to enjoy the moments. He won't be little forever. I know that doesn't help answer your questions, but you just sounded a lot like how I feel often. :)
I do still try to follow Babywise and I do want my baby to have healthy sleep habits. I remember when my son was around 5 -6 months old, he was ready to switch to 3 1/2 to 4 hours between feedings (I strictly breastfeed and also started solids around that time). So, that switched his naptime to more like 2 hours apart. At that age, he still took about 3 naps a day. I had also read in Babywise (there's a second book), that when a baby wakes up a half hour or 45 minutes after falling asleep that they are more aware of their surroundings and hearing the normal sounds around them. My son did that around 6 months. They don't want to go back to sleep. We did the cry-it-out method for naps and it worked. It took about 3 days. But now I'm going to have to do it again, because after a month of colds/growth spurts/teething, we again are rocking him to sleep. But I'm not beating myself up! Nor am I looking forward to starting over. Maybe I'll look into Ferber this time!! Best wishes with the sleeping! I'd love to hear what works for you.

hi J., We did the ferber method with our son but he was older...1 year. It was difficult but my husband & i felt it was best...I didn't breast feed but I can tell you that if your daughter does fall asleep, i wouldn't wake her just for a feeding. However if she is crying sooo long that you think she's getting hungry you do need to feed at that point. We now have 8 month old twins (older son 5yrs) & i am readjusting to the sleep thing & have realized a hungry baby will almost never go to sleep!!! They just seem to cry more...The other thing is you have to make sure she is tired enough but NOT over tired as well..sometimes its difficult for them if they are irritable & really tired...My older son was on a very good eat, wake, sleep sched. but just to remind you that isn't always the case for every baby as much as you try !!! People were very critical of us for using the Ferber method but we stuck it out & it we had great success. ( My husband had such a hard time listening to the crying he had to go outside) It killed him to let him cry...But our problem was that he wouldn't go to sleep for anyone else but us & we had difficulty with sitters....I wish you well & hope you stick it out !!! let me know...Kelley

Hi J.. I know what you're going through. We had trouble with our 4 1/2 month old napping. She was only sleeping maybe 1 1/2 hrs a day! The doctor recommended a variation of the Ferber method and we actually tweaked it a bit by supplmenting it with The Sleepeasy Solution by Jennifer Waldburger. This book was so easy to follow that I had a great "sleep plan" in less than 2 hours. We saw results after 3 or 4 days of consistently following the sleep plan. Anyway, she is now sleeping 12 hrs a night and 4 hrs a day in naps!! And I have my happy, loving baby girl back!
When her naps were going to be intrerrupted by her nursing schedule I would feed her a half hour to forty five minutes before I lay her down so that it would keep her full through that nap period, even if I'd already fed her an hour before. My baby also liked to be nursed to sleep but I would sing or give her a gentle shake or even burp her to keep her awake so that she would go in her crib awake for her nap. I hope this helps. I would recommend looking at the Sleepeasy Solution if only for general information on development and how much sleep your baby requires at her age ( it goes up to five years old and deals with every conceivable problem you might run into ). I wish you luck and much success!
R.

Have you read "sleepelss in america" by mary sheedy kurkinca. It could be that your not catching her when shes in her 'window" and ready to sleep. She may be overtired when you but her down nad can't switch to sleep. Its a wonderful book and you get them same results. Its also worth reading up on the physiological effects of letting a baby cry it out. Its something that is rarely mentioned in the cry it out methods but is quite unnerving to me. I've had four kids and the cry it out method produced night terrors in later years for the ones who cried it out and not in hte ones who were soothed to sleep.
I respect the choice is yours but sometimes the guilty feelings are a mothers internal sense of letting you know somethings not qiute right in what your doing.
good luck

We had success with the 3 Day Sleep Solution... it honestly worked a miracle for us.

Are you sure that she's tired when you're putting down for naps/bed? At 5 months, they start working more into a schedule, and maybe you just haven't figured hers out yet. Personally, it sounds to me like you're putting her down for her second nap too soon. Wait a while and she'll be tired and start to work into her own schedule. I found that with my daughter that when I tried to use my own ideas about what her schedule should be I'd always have problems. She'll let you know and it'll be SOO much easier.

Some thoughts: first, I agree with the other poster that maybe she's not tired enough yet. My son was definitely good for at least 2 hours between naps at that age (we were a Healthy Sleep Habits family) and he was a good napper. Second, as long as your child sometimes falls asleep not nursing, it's ok if she falls asleep nursing some or even most of the time. Third, she won't sleep through a feeding if she's really hungry or fall asleep. You might have to go in to feed and then try again later. Crying it out worked for us, but our son was 7 months when we finally did it. Good luck!