Ungrateful Super Pickiness

Some good responses and I struggle a bit with this too with one of my kids. She gets it from me... Not the ungratefulness piece with us so much but just a negative outlook. I started having her list 3 things at the end of every day that were good and she's allowed to say one bad thing too. I believe the mind has to be trained to focus on the good. So I acknowledge the bad but am trying to make her focus on the good. I believe it will become habit over time. You could try something along these lines. I have to say I've stopped bc she doesn't complain as much as she used to... I should restart anyway though. I think an end of day focus on the good that happened that day is a beneficial exercise for everyone.

Sounds like a couple things are going on here. I would get her evaluated by a occupational therapist as kids who have unrecognized sensory issues tend to be more sensitive and edgy. So things do bother them much more than other children. They also tend to be very observant. Too observant, and that causes them pain both emotionally and physically. I think you need to be a little tough on her. If she is genuinely ill then cut her some slack but as in the muffin or candy bag incident, I would acknowledge her feelings but say if you hear another word about it, it will go in the garbage. I would also stop buying her anything or giving her anything for a while. She can do chores and other extras to earn treats but that's it. My friend's son is like this (although I think he might have Aspergers) and it is a problem.

I'm not going to write a big response here because you have received a lot of answers. I am a pediatric physical therapist that works with occupational therapists that treat "twice exceptional" children. Having a disorder is not always a bad thing and evaluations can be very helpful. Google "twice exceptional children".

You need to decide with yourself if this is bad behavior or not. You keep going back and forth with yourself, that it is so annoying behavior yet on the other side you see her as very observant and selective and it will serve her good later in life............
This behavior is nothing new nor nothing special. Kids do this if allowed! You get what you get and you don't throw a fit!!!! If my kid uttered a single complaint about the CANDY that they got, I'd tell them to appreciate it or I'll throw the whole thing in the trash if I hear one more negative word about it!!!!

What did you do at 17mo when her cheese broke? give her another piece??? No.way.
Oh, what? your muffing isn't big enough, well then here, let me throw it in the trash and YOU'RE DONE!!!!!
It's not about being picky, it's about being spoiled.........nip it now.

ETA - just wanted to also add that both of my kids are academically "gifted" and attend a special "gifted" class one day per wk for it. Being smart isn't an excuse for being a brat. I can't believe all the responses you are getting about trying to see the world thru her eyes and asking her questions, blah, blah, blah - it will only give her attention and reinforce this behavior. That's what's wrong with so many kids these days! Their parents try to understand where they are coming from......and how they are feeling....... Instead of saying, hey, you're being a brat, knock it off!!!!

I agree with everyone. She sounds very intelligent, a bit sensory-sensitive, and like she might be in need of a little dose of tough love.

I think your mantra should just be, "I'm sorry you don't like X. If you don't want it, you're welcome to not have dessert / go to school in your underwear / not go to the party / etc." I also use the line "That's an interesting problem. How do you plan on solving it?" a lot. She'll probably be miserable, briefly, but she needs to learn that she can survive that miserable feeling. By letting her feel it and survive it, you're giving her strength.

Finally, it truly is okay to pick your battles, but I might recommend picking slightly different battles. If she has a wardrobe full of nice clothes, then wonderful. No new clothes until she outgrows the ones she's got. But if socks are a huge issue, then okay. She'll probably survive without wearing socks.

J. - The thing that jumped out at me was your statement that "she has tons of gorgeous clothes."

To a large extent, your daughter was born this way. But the best thing you can do for your daughter is to start giving her a lot less. If she takes things for granted, then she shouldn't have them. Stop buying her so many clothes, for starters. Make her work more for things, in one way or another.

You won't convince her by moralizing to her or reading books on generosity. You need to make her learn to appreciate what she has. Therefore, if she complains about something -- take it away. If she complains about her muffin -- she gets no muffin. If she refuses to wear an item of clothing -- give it away and don't replace it. If she says, "I have less than so and so," respond, "Oh well, life's not fair." (Which is true.) If she complains about her bag of candy -- take it away. Don't get angry or make a big deal out of it, just calmly and nicely say something like, "Sorry, if you can't appreciate it, you can't have it." And then remove whatever it is. If she cries and tantrums after you take the thing away, ignore it and go on about your business.

Some people are inherently difficult. My best friend, whom I've known for over 40 years, was like your daughter from infancy. (And I was the brunt of her attitude in my teens.) She would and does agree that her picky, entitled behavior should not have been tolerated.

Start with all that, and you will begin to see some changes, but it will take a while. Be consistent. It really is important that you get this under control.

And yes, pluck the card out of her hand and send it.

Per your SWH - she doesn't need to be sent to her room -- that won't give the right message, it will just make her feel more unfairly treated. Just take the thing she's complaining about away.

Per Tiffany's response - J. sees plenty of beauty in her daughter. She's not one of those moms. But she does have a more inherently difficult child, and those do exist.

Two things - it could be "stuff and selfishness". No young kid needs that much stuff. Start reducing it.

OR - she could have sensory issues so have her evaluated. Most kids DON'T take that long, wear the same things that are comfortable, or need to exercise that much control. Make sure there isn't more to it than her being annoying.

And she's 5 - you can't expect miracles of appreciation from a 5 year old, but you can model it.

ADD: A physiological disorder is not a "social construct". I'm glad she doesn't have any challenge like this, but please don't disrespect people who are dealing with REAL, DIAGNOSED issues and trying to offer constructive help.

Some of it sounds like sensory issues. You might want to have her evaluated by a pediatric occupational therapist familiar with sensory issues. I have a kid like this too so I don't know the answer to all of it, but he does have sensory issues. You also might want to check out the book and workbook "Raising Your Spirited Child." She sounds "spirited." I found them helpful.

ETA: Having sensory issues is not a "disorder" and many children, including mine, have been helped by going through OT for sensory issues. It is not invasive and does not involve labeling, medications, etc. I would compare it to having PT for a physical issue.

This is coming from me, hippy dippy, attachment parent, let's discuss options, etc: )

Tough love, now. You don't like it, you get none. You don't like your clothes, wear your pajamas to school and pick them out the night before. Not enough candy, how about none? Now textures are an entirely different story, sensory-wise, but this other stuff is a 1st world problem. Empathy and selfishness are very different. Is she indulged? Sounds so. And, she's empathetic. Too, generosity and selfishness are different. Generosity doesn't sound like the problem. "She has so much, yet, none of it is good enough." Stop giving.

I would wonder a bit about OCD and anxiety . . . before I started exploring that, though, I'd probably just stop giving her much attention for the behavior. It sounds like you are trying hard to please her. What happens if you just blow by, or mostly ignore, her complaints and comments?

If it's hard for you to listen to, imagine what it's like in her little head, feeling so negative much of the time? It can't be a good feeling.

I would try to get at the root of what is causing her extreme sensitivity. It could be biological, it could be behavioral, or a combination of both.

I'm not an expert of any type - this is just my mom opinion.

ETA: I agree with exploring the sensory issues further too.

Ah the world of an analytical gifted child. I don't know that I agree that she is being ungrateful. Although certainly I understand that it looks that way.

I agree with OCD and anxiety - However, these are traits I have had since birth as well, so I identify a bit with your daughter. I suggest that the same way you can't "see" the world the way she does (negatively, from your perspective) she CAN'T "see" the world the same way you do. So, I'm not sure that getting her to see the beauty in the world is necessarily the way to go. That's just like HER trying to get YOU to see differences, from an analytical perspective. If you don't.... you don't.

Instead of getting frustrated (and I agree... giving her attention) instead ask her what "that" means. She's being observant and these "facts" are important to her. VERY important to her. But they don't have to be "emotional", unless you make them emotional. SHE sometimes makes them emotional.... because she is 5 and can't process all the stuff her brain wants her to process.... so she gets overloaded.

"Her muffin is bigger than mine". Could you step back, look for a minute and say "good observation.... what do you think that means?". To her it might mean that whoever gave out the muffins likes the other girl better. Or it might mean that she can say something like "when the maker poured the muffins more batter got in to the other cup so when it baked the muffins are not the same size". or you could simply say "yes, it is".

It's harder to parent a strong willed analytical child, especially if they are very different than you. Instead of focusing so much on helping her change.... I might focus more on you working to not be as frustrated with her. Let her be her.

Good Luck.

Are you familiar with the character Veruca Salt, from Charlie and the Chocolate Factory? Whenever one of my girls starts complaining about what they "don't" have I remind them not to be a Veruca.
Veruca was a little girl who's parents went out of their way to make sure she had everything she wanted and needed. They couldn't bear to see her unhappy. They always tried to ration and reason with her, and placate her at all costs. And of course Veruca was a very unhappy girl because you can't really reason with a young child, and there's always "more" to be had, isn't there?
I have never let my kids have "tons" of anything, be it clothes, toys, whatever (well, except books and legos, lol!) When I did a clean out of their room I said either you come in and choose X number of things to go or I'll do it for you.
Your cupcake's not big enough? You can give it to me then, I'll enjoy it.
And PLEASE don't use her supposed intelligence as a reason or excuse for her behavior, I don't know why you even mention it, it has NOTHING to do with kindness, compassion or attitude. Being bright does not automatically make a person a jerk.

I have always used the term the glass is half full never ever have I said it is half empty.Theres been a few times when the kids will point out that something appears bigger than theirs I let them know yes it sure looks that way but in the end it all ends up on the floor & in your tummies so enjoy what you have or you can save it for later if you choose to have a fit over it.If they become to the point that they need to be sent to their room to cool down I sure will do it no giving in it once that happens it will spiral down hill & then you'll have a fit throwing child over everything

One of my children is like this...he is 8 now and is much more empathetic and reasonable than he used to be. He is also very smart and in the gifted program in school. He has sensory issues which he is outgrowing. He is very sensitive and has very high strung emotions. He gets angry at times when he does not get his way. He is more self centered. He is often trying to argue with us to get his way. These are all things we are constantly working on. I agree with the parents who say to nip it in the bud now. I was too lenient when he was younger (ages 2-4) and as he got older he became more and more impossible. My husband and I learned to be very black and white about things. We state the rules, we state the consequences, and we don't let him get away with stuff anymore. We don't let him make the decisions. We steer him to do what is right in life. Yes it causes huge tantrums but it has been really good for him to learn he cannot just get what he wants in life. The good news is he has gotten much better and much more mature as he has gotten older. He is a totally exhausting child to parent but no one ever said parenting is easy. Added: I guess I want to add that my son is picky also but not so quick to be negative anymore. He is also very passionate and exhuberant and has many friends. His pickiness has not really gotten much better as he has gotten older...maybe a teeny bit but not enough! Maybe this is a personality trait but I still think it is something to constantly be working on. Have conversations with your daughter about the right thing to do or the right way to think. As she gets older she will get it better and she will mirror what she sees you and her dad doing as you react to disappointments in life. Watch the movie "Babies" with her and talk about how there are many people in the world who do not have much stuff or things. Talk about what is truly important. My son and I have had some amazing conversations about subjects such as homeless people and third world countries. When he is older we plan on going on a working vacation to help build a school in a third world country. Your daughter is still very young and at that age many kids are just naturally very self centered. She will improve with age!

I agree with the analytical gifted child characterization. Look up the traits of gifted children. You have described many of them. I need to remind myself of that when I am about to pull my hair out due to my child's picky eating / clothing habits. Would you believe that cupcakes can have too much frosting, and sweaters (of any kind) are too puffy? Resources for gifted parents may be helpful for you. I don't buy "learned behavior" or OCD/anxiety. I think you have a gifted child.

Best wishes, they are both amazing and challenging little people!

PS Just because they are gifted, does not mean they should be allowed to be brats. But resources on parenting these kids might help!

Your daughter has learned this behavior. And she has learned some of it from you. You want her to "see the beauty in the world, then start seeing the beauty in her. You want her to "see and appreciate what she does have", then see and appreciate the amazing daughter you have. Every time you focus on the bad/wrong things she is doing you are giving her the message that she isn't good enough. And she has the clear picture that it isn't the behavior that is wrong, it is her that is wrong.

She is receiving a very clear message from you that she isn't good enough and she is then projecting this out into her world. When we have a core belief about who we are then the world gets filtered through that belief. Your daughter sees what she feels. She is only 5 years old. She is only playing out what she has been taught about herself.

She is intelligent, she is creative, she is "passionate and exuberant", she communicates clearly and openly, etc. These are the aspects that you as a mother need to shift focus to and encourage and appreciate.

Yes, she is sensitive. Allow her the space to figure this out for herself. As long as you have the thought that "She shouldn't be so sensitive." you will invalidate her and add to her belief that she isn't good enough. Instead, gather information on sensitive children. Seek out tools and educate yourself on how best to support her rather than "fix" her.

There is nothing wrong with your daughter. You just need to understand her, appreciate all the amazing things about her, create some space for her to work things out, and get yourself the support and tools you need to create the shift for you.

ETA: I LOVE what Angela said!! I should have noticed that too...you are giving her attention for her behavior to try and make her world perfect. The world isn't perfect. Stop caving in and giving in to her tantrums!!
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Your daughter needs help. There is something that is "wrong" - it's not finickiness and negativity - it's almost OCD - wearing outfits for days at time? Sorry - my daughter had nice clothes too but didn't wear them for days at a time.

Get her evaluated by a mental health/psychiatrist - to see if she has OCD or some other issue.

FOR ME AND IN MY WORLD - this is my opinion!!
It's not normal to be THAT negative at 5.
It's NOT normal to a temper tantrum over a broken piece of cheese.
It's NOT normal to wear the same clothes for days - even though she has a selection to choose from.

I'm sorry - I am NOT trying to be mean. I just don't see any of this as "normal". I had a kid like this in the day care I worked at - life was walking on eggshells for the parents until our center director told them she needed help. Her expressions of negativity and such were NOT normal - VERY exaggerated, etc. The parents did NOT like to hear that - they were VERY UPSET. Who wouldn't be? Many parents want to believe it's just a phase or it's normal....it's not. please get her help.

Chiming in from Gifted-Land:

Most gifted kids HAVE disorders (as a matter of fact: most people in gifted-land are on a steady campaign to get giftedness recognized as a spectrum disorder in and of itself, like ASD). But, again, most gifted kids have disorders of various types. Ranging from SPD, ADHD, Aspies, OCD, Asymmetrical Development, etc.

NAMING a thing... Whether its giftedness (and here's PART the spectrum: Gifted, Highly Gifted, Profoundly Gifted), ADHD, SPD, artistic, musical, analytical, et cetera... Doesn't alter a thing.

Its still the same as it always was.

It simply has a name.

And with a name... Common characteristics, strategies, community, etc.

Giftedness is a social construct with philosophies & practicalities AS MUCH as every other.

And as with every other disorder... It exists across all societies & cultures regardless of whether or not its named & recognized, and whether or not its helpful or problematic.

Just a thing to keep in mind as you walk this road.

Labeling can be a GREAT thing.

Just a moment ago, with your 'Aha!' Reaction... Stumbling across a shared characteristic trait set of other kids that match your daughter... That's 100% because of labeling, organizing, sharing resources/troubles/strategies.

...

A lot of people are very prejudiced (even bigoted) about the idea of labeling and evaluations... Right up until they need help with their kid... And even then, many refuse to get the help that would make life amazing, Aha!, extraordinary... Instead of a constant challenge.

Even more people have to suffer through other's bigotry (claiming the "don't believe" in blah blah blah ... Because with THEIR kid al they had to do was blah blah blah).

If you have a gifted kid, you have my condolences... Because its not an easy road to walk. It can be an adventure, for sure! But its not easy. There is an awful lot that parents of neurotypical kids will never have to go through, get, or understand. BUT please, please, please... Don't be one of those parents making life hard for other parents by waving away & dismissing anything outside of your own normal. Sure... They're social constructs. Doesn't mean that they're not a great many people's reality. Including yours, if youve got a gifted kiddo.

Well the "problem" is that she is a compare-er. She compares... herself to everything. Good or bad.

To me, the problem isn't that she is picky... she just compares everything and it seems, nothing is good enough.
Even some adults are that way.
But yes, I can understand it is frustrating.

Is there anyone in her life, or a caregiver, that is this way? She could be parroting, that person.

A person who is always comparing themselves to others... can never be "satisfied." And it can also turn into a person who copy-cats others. Because they always want what someone else has etc.

The key, is for her to learn to be herself. To be her own, person.

Ok, so maybe not a spoiled brat, but maybe a little overindulged? Have her do some chores, volunteer with you for the elderly or less fortunate, experience some sense of unpleasantness from time to time and she will be MUCH more appreciative of the good things in her life. Trust me, I have a 12 yr old who was very much like your daughter, so I totally understand where you're coming from. She is going through the teen angst thing right now, but chores are the best thing for creating a kid thankful for their freedoms and privileges.

Updated

I don't have many suggestions other than what others have written about saying "if you don't like it, then you don't get to have it" and limiting her choices. But I wanted to say that my oldest daughter, age 6, has many of the same traits as yours. When she was a toddler she was very particular about things: she'd have a half hour tantrum because her oatmeal wasn't flat enough (don't ask). I used to think something was wrong with her. But she is most definitely normal... just gifted and very spirited. Not "difficult" or a brat. Her teachers have told me since she was three that she's gifted and after three different ones said the same thing, I believed them. She has an amazing memory. She understands concepts most kids don't get until much older (how rain is made, etc.) and can explain them well to others. She argues semantics and every little minute detail which drives me bonkers. And she can be draining to spend a whole week with! Someday she'll make a great lawyer, teacher, or CEO, but right now it's tough channeling her energy and intellect for good instead of bad, though all day kindergarten helped immensely. She's just affected by things more than other kids, notices more, and is more sensitive and more easily upset. That doesn't mean there's something wrong with her. Reading the book, Parenting your Spirited Child helped me gain a different perspective about her, as well as reading about gifted children. In my opinion, there is absolutely nothing wrong with your daughter, either, and I bet she shares many of the same reasons for her behavior as my daughter.

My daughter has been heading down that road too. I had to take a hard look at myself and what I was doing and how that might be affecting her. Bottom line, my daughter has too much. I buy her too many things. We would go to any store and she would get something. Sometimes it was less than $5 sometimes it would be $30. She also always insists on dessert after a meal and she was getting something nearly every time. All of this I allowed because most times I thought it was harmless and the rest of the time I didn't want to hear the complaining if she didn't get something. Now, I have had to correct my own behavior in order to begin to correct hers. We have to have long conversations about want vs. need and about respect. We have to look at what we do have and be grateful for it. We have to give genuine thanks for everything that we receive even when someone else has gotten more. These conversations, etc...happen on a daily basis. My daughter is doing better but sometimes she throws a pity party for herself and when she does I listen to what she is saying, offer some advice and comfort, and then send her on her way to her room where she stays until she has calmed down. Good Luck with your daughter!

You have given her way too much at a young age and she has no respect for anything. As far as clothes, clean out her room when she is not home, and give her only what she can wear in a week nothing more. She is young enough for you to teach her respect. No extra stuff, make her appreciate what she has. If it breaks, oh well, you don't get another one. The time it takes her to get dressed in the morning, make her lay out her clothes in the evening before bed. Give her bare minimum of anything. You as an adult have to show her to appreciate what she has and to be grateful. This falls on the parent, you don't need to shower your child to accommodate her. You need to tell her to deal with it, draw back all the fun extra things, and make her realize most children don't have these things she does. You as the parent have to change this and show her, you have created this situation to make her happy, not her.

I agree with Julia S. Your daughter sounds an awful lot like mine. My daughter has Sensory Processing Disorder. She is also super senstive as well as a sensitive gifted child. All of those things are wrapped up in one package; my daughter. Rather than think it's an awful thing that my daughter has this or that or even this, knowing "what" she has gives me a place to turn to to find out how I can help her. It also helps me better understand her, how she thinks, why she thinks and does the things she does, etc.

She received speech therapy as well as OT/PT for hypotonia through the school district when she was younger. She received NO HELP for her specialness. Everything she has learned--to include how to deal with friends and social situations--has come from me learning how to help her cope. Is it hard? You'd better believe it! What makes it even more difficult is that there is no manual for parenting these special children. Every one of them is special and unique, with their own blueprint as to how to raise them.

So I understand your frustration. Been there, done that, and am now prepared to enter the teenage years. There's no manual for that either!

I think you might be on to something about her clothes. I obviously don't know you or your daughter, so I can't say this with any authority at all, but when she is picking out her clothes, is she getting overwhelmed? You said she has too many pieces of clothes, and maybe it's just that? Maybe it is just too much for her to handle. She isn't quite 5 yet, so maybe select two or three outfits for her to choose from and give her no other options?
I know if my little lady (She is 4 1/2) has more than two or three choices of clothing she goes into an almost frantic state. She also has a LOT of clothes, so I will take a couple of what ever type of outfit she needs (pants, or dresses or skirts etc.) and let her pick from what it has already been narrowed down too.

Try "Veggie Tales" they all are about different situations and solutions. They teach children in a fun way how to act towards others and be happy with what they have. They are fun to watch with your kids too.

J.-
Your daughter & my son should get together! I wish I had any suggestions but it's comforting to know that there are other children out there like him. Thanks for posting this. Lots of good feedback.

How about showing her how good she has it compared to other kids? Volunteer with her at a homeless shelter or soup kitchen, donate some toys to a pediatric ward at a local hospital, etc. Even just watching the documentary "Babies" had a huge impact on my 5 year old (it tracks the first year of life of 4 babies, one in San Fran, one in Tokyo, one is Africa and one in Mongolia). My kid literally could not believe how different other people live than we do. Kids only know the world that they are exposed too, and often times aren't even aware of how good they have it. Good luck.