3 Yr Old WHINER

It sounds like we are in the same boat!!! I have a 9 1/2 month old and my other daughter will be 4 in Sept. also. She is driving me crazy! I keep hearing it's just the age. I have tried everything, talking, yelling, taking things away, we have a system we are using that she earns tickets each day and then she gets to "buy" things with it. She has been able to buy play dates with her friends, movie nights w/ Mommy and Daddy, and little things I pick up that are inexpensive, etc. That worked for a while, but right now, I don't know what to do! When she whines, I tell her I can't hear her when she whines and she usually changes that. Hang in there! You aren't alone!

Hi M.,
Sorry, this is going to be a VERY long post, but I just went through the SAME THING with my 3 yr old and had MIRACULOUS results. We were at our wits end, and now I think it's fixed--in a WEEK. So please take the time to read this post--I think it will really help!!

Honestly, my 3 yr old (first and only child at the moment)was out of control and I was just not willing to see it. I just thought we were "struggling" with his behaviour and that it was a phase and we should just keep trying and he'd grow out of it. But then my MIL watched him over the weekend and had a tough-love heart-to-heart with me saying that my son was obviously very smart and had learned to manipulate and rule the roost. She loves him and thinks the world of him and that's why she had this talk with me--as gently as she could. She pointed out that if I didn’t get control over him now that he was 3, what would he be like when he was 15?? She pointed out that not only was he ignoring and disrespecting me, he had no real respect for adults in general—he was always in charge. He just ignored anything that bored him or he didn't want to do, etc and acted like he didn't hear. And if he doesn’t listen to grown-ups now, he’s not going to listen to his teachers either, or even the police (some day, god forbid)… She was right. He wouldn’t sit in time out, he had a meltdown almost everytime we said to do anything! Dinner—NO he wants pudding, Bedtime—NO he wants more stories, or his belly hurts or food or water… It’s hard to say no to a 3 yr old who says, “But Mommy, by belly says it’s hunnnggrrryyyyyy!" and collapses to the floor dramatically...

She was right and she scared me straight. :) I put my foot down and got very CONSISTENT. I stopped giving in if he whined enough. I made 3 rules for the house: LISTEN to Mommy and Daddy, NO throwing things, and NO hurting people (hitting, kicking, etc). I also taught him that when he was angry he was supposed to stomp his foot—not throw things or hit mommy or his teachers. (and I still tell him good job when he’s angry and stops his feet—I’m trying to get him to learn to control his anger and emotions in a non-destructive or hurtful manner).

Now, as soon as he is disrespectful (angrily says NO to me, or doesn’t listen to me on the 2nd request, etc), I immediately pick him up and put him in time out, but I stay there with him, kneel down in front on him eye to eye and ask him to tell me what our rules are. I make him stay there until he can “remember them” (I had to help him remember them at first, of course). He repeats all the rules to me (only 3 rules, so he’s not overwhelmed, and repeating them in time-out reinforces them). So he tells me what the rules are (I try to make him look at me when he says them), and then I ask him which rule he broke. Then I agree that he broke that rule and tell him he needs to say he’s sorry. He does and then we hug and he is let up. We put him to bed in his own bed after our bedtime routine (same routine plus stories every night), and when he gets up, we matter-of-factly put him back to bed with no words or affection. Again and again—it was maybe 20 times the first night! Hungry? Sorry, kitchen is CLOSED (we remind him at dinner that kitchen will be closed so eat until your belly is full). Next night it was less, next night less. When he got in our bed in the middle of the night, we got up and led him back to his room—every time.

He knew there was a power shift going on and he tried to fight it! But now, he is a changed kid—and I mean within a week. He listens, he sits in time out, he GOES TO BED in his own bed without getting back up!!! And he pretty much stays in bed (we still put him back in the middle of the night some nights—last night twice…). And you know the most interesting thing? He’s HAPPIER!

I was starting to think he had an anger management problem before—always so angry and negative! Destructive, hitting, out of control, but now he’s a happy little guy. I guess it’s true—kids NEED discipline, they need to push you and see that you will not give or be manipulated. At the end of the day, it makes them feel safe that you are in charge. A 3 yr old should not feel like he is in control of his own destiny—I think subconsciously that scares them. Now that we are acting like PARENTS and expecting him to step up and behave like a good family team member—we’ve stepped up our expectations of him instead of still treating him with kid gloves like he’s still a baby—we have not only made him a well-behaved child, but we’ve actually made him happier. We’re ALL happier.

Few more thoughts: we ignore him and tell him we can't hear him when he whines. He loses his privileges if he acts up too much (no going outside, no watching TV, etc and we don't give in!) If he acts up when we're out, he gets time out when we get home, even if it's hours later, and he always remembers why! It will be exhausting at first, being that consistent, but it will pay off and take less and less effort very quickly.

Finally, and this is important, I think as as a mother of a 3 yr old, it's easy to be easy on them and not raise your expectations of their behavior because you are maybe not ready (or you think they are not ready)to make that transition from baby to kid, so you are still "babying" them and letting them get away with stuff. In other words, you wouldn't "punish" a baby for crying or not behaving (because they are just a baby!), but of course you WOULD punish a 5 yr old not behaving, right? Three years olds are kinda in that transition period where it can be hard to know when to change your expectations from what you would expect from a baby to what you would expect from a 5 yr old. It's a spectrum of behavior of course, but I hope you get my point... I know for me I had not mentally made that transition for him to start behaving like he is capable of at his age. But when I did, he stepped up and I am so proud of him and we are all so much happier!! I hope this helps! good luck!!

The very second the sass starts you take her hand and lead her to the time out chair.Don't say a single thing to her except why she's going into time out. While in time out, she gets NOTHING except a wall to look at. If she cries, screams, whatever, ignore it. The only thing you should not ignore is when she leaves her time out place before time is up. When she does, the time starts all over again.
The key is to say NOTHING to her except the reason why she's going there.. Think about it.. Were YOU allowed to say "no" to your Mother?? My guess is no, but HELL no.. Just like me. Don't take that sass.. It'll lead to worse things in the future.

okay this is the best I got cause my 3 year old step daughter used to be this way, so this is what works for her.
As for the getting into trouble and getting a time out she has to sit there until she can tell me why she is in trouble by this I mean that if she is yelling and I tell her she needs to be quiet and she continues on I will ask her do you want a time out the responce is normally no. If she continues to yell I will have her sit on her bed (if any where else she will try to throw things) I wait for her to calm cause she is crying at this point so I leave her cry till its not so loud I go back in and say do you know why you are in trouble if she says yes I ask her to tell me normally its something about me being mean. lol I explain to her that she was being mean by not listening I ask if I yell and she says no I ask if daddy yells and even if mommy yells all these answers are no then I say well If I'm not aloud to yell and daddy isn't aloud to yell then why can mariah yell? Then again I tell her that she was being mean and if she doesn't want us to be mean and she wants us to listen then she needs to too. Again I will ask her why she is in trouble and we go over this over and over till she can tell me why, at first it is very time consuming but once she realizes that she isn't getting up till she understands it gets better. With me doing this with her she will now tell someone I got a time out today and when they ask why she tells them the truth because I want to make sure she understands completely what she is doing wrong so we can fix the problem. Its just like before we go into a store we have a talk I tell her she has to be good no whining and if she does start whining we will have to sit in the car and wait for daddy and she won't be able to go in with him any more I am big on giving cause and effect before going into stores and any other public places. I found this is what works best for her, it took time but everyone says she is well behaved for a 3 year old.
At bed time she used to keep getting up and crying it got to the point that the most attention she got was when she did this was me carrying back to the room I wouldn't even say anything to her I would carry her back and put her in bed she would get tired and finally pass out I know it sucks but if you can just stick to this for a week instead of going in there and sitting or trying to calm them down. After a week it normally gets easier. Hope this helps

I know she is my step daughter but we have full custody and I love her like she is mine, and have been raising her for the last 2.5 years.

My kids were doing the same thing for a while, Aurora is 4 and Gabriel is 3. Wehn they were about 2 and 3 they did this and we found that just stopping things like story time if they were acting up helps. We have movie time here at night and if they are acting up they lose that privilage. Also as far as her waking up her brother when my daughter did this she would get a spanking. It is never hard, but it does get her attention. I don't know where you stand on that, but it is what worked for us. Rest assured it is a phase and she will grow out of it as long as mom does'nt appear to give in, that's the hardest part I know. As far as the yelling if you don't respond to it you just lay her back down or sit her down and walk away she will stop as she will get tired of being ignored, but as soon as she is being sweet reward her for it and praise her, it will help to reinforce the good instead of the bad. I hated to hear her fuss, but she needed to. Also if it is at all possible to put them in seperate rooms till she's asleep you might try that, I don't know how heavy a sleeper your youngest is. I hope this helps and if you want to talk or vent the frustration I understand so feel free to message me.
Sincerely,
A.

We all want to believe our children can reason things out, maybe they can more than I think they do, but at 3 I am not sure she can think through the way she is behaving.
She gets a great reaction with the constant "NO" and attention. Children don't much care if it is positive or negative attention as long as the world is centered on them at the moment.
I am not saying she should think it is all right to tell you "NO", I definitely do not. I don't think the action should go unpunished, it shouldn't. I agree with the time out, taking away privelages is great with me too.
I wonder if just ignoring it for a day, not reacting to the word itself wouldn't help, but only reacting to actions.
Example: You say it is time for lunch, she says "No", instead of fixing her lunch she simply does not get any lunch but you and the baby do. You say it is time to get dressed, she says "No" so she just stays in her pajamas. You ask her to pick up her toys, she says "No" you tell her if she doesn't pick them up you will and she won't have them for a while, she yells "No" again so you pick them up, put them in a box or bag and they aren't available to her for a week. You tell her it is bedtime, she says "No" and you explain if she doesn't go to bed there will not be a story tonight, she repeats "No" so she goes to bed with no story. You give her a hug, turn out the light and leave the room. She yells and gets up, she is firmly put back to bed with the warning if she wakes the baby she will get two swats on the behind. She gets up or yells and wakes the baby and she gets two definite swats on the behind. Face it, her crying now is for just cause and the baby is awake anyway and there is no cuddles and no sympathy for her and she is put firmly back to bed.
Just a suggestion.

Such a relief to read this post. My son is 2yrs and is starting to give me the same problems you describe. It has helped me to read the comments other mothers have posted. I really enjoyed reading Tracy T's post. Great ideas that I will implement in my home. I like the idea of having only 3 rules, makes it more manageable for the little ones.

The only thing that I have really noticed that works with my son is to keep my own temper in check and discipline him with a very calm voice. I tell myself that once I raise my voice I have lost the battle. If I want my son to be a kind person, then I must model the behavior. So I am very firm but kind.

good luck! Thanks for sharing your situation, it has helped me out to read these posts today!

Hi M.,

My kids are exactly the same ages and I am having a lot of the same problems. If you get any good advice can you please forward it to me? Thank you!

____@____.com

Okay, this is why I love this site b/c I know I'm not having an isolated situation. Ck this out:
http://www.babycenter.com/404_how-can-i-teach-my-toddler-...

My daughter is going to be three and has been acting similarly for 3 mos or so now. We have a similar situation (as far as spending time w/ her) & reaction (time out's & toy removal). My friends tell me it's a phase & part of her development/ testing our authority, and of course they tell me to pray-pray-pray. But I really like what this site had to say about children needing to "seek out their independence." Hope this helps!

I think Pam R. is onto the right idea. It's classic Love and Logic - actions have consequences - no yelling, screaming, getting mad. Just follow through with a consequence and the ones she suggests are good. If that means she goes out in public with her PJ's on, so be it. The other thing you can add is, "when you yell at me like that, I can't hear you" and you walk away or "when you yell at me like that, it really hurts my ears and I can't understand you. I'm sorry to tell you this, but you will have to go into your room until you can talk to me in a polite and normal voice" and then make sure she gets to her room. Don't let her change her tone without going to her room first. Once she settles down and comes back, then you can talk. If she starts the nastiness again, do the same thing. She will figure out that those behaviors are not getting her what she wants and she will try something new.

M., I dont know if i can help, my husband also works 2nd, so ya, its hard. It just seems easier to parent alone during the day. We made the choice, however, since I work 5am till 2 pm 4 days a week, not to put our kids in daycare, plus, economically it isnt feasible. Our son is now 5 1/2, when our Sommer was with us ( we had 75 glorious days with her before she passed of SIDS), 2nd was especially hard. An almost 3 yr old, and an infant.(and then the grief) I just found setting bounderies is what worked. Ya, a routine is helpful, but here in NE Ohio, routines fly out the window once the weather breaks. Daddy and I have always agreed on "punishment", ( no spanking, though he has got it a few times:-)) but that you follow Mamas rules, even when Daddy isnt home. The terrible twos are SO overrated, it is the threes. Because Daddy has a bigger voice and a more formidible attitude, all I have to say is Do You Want Me To Call Daddy? It worked for me as a child, thats all my mom ever had to say to me, and I instantly snapped out of my mood. Still would if I thought Daddy would reprimand me:-)(and I am 40 years old) Have Daddy have a talk, just maybe 2 sentances, You listen to Mama. If you dont mama will call me. Then you deal with me. Also, I have found time out to be fairly ineffective, rather, go to your room, you may not speak to me or interact with the dog or cat until you can behave, worked better for me. He and the dog are inseperable. Sorry this got so long, ( as a 2nd shift wife, you probably know as well as I, I miss the interaction with adults) Feel free to email anytime, ____@____.com if you feel like talking. Good Luck, and just give her extra kisses and hugs. God Bless, A.

All I can say is that it is the age. I thought we werent going to have any problems with our son since we flew through the 2's without any problems. Within a month of him being 3 he has started doing the same thing your child has been doing. Our neighbor's daughter was 3 last year and she was doing the same things also last year. She is now 4 and has improved greatly. So I guess the only advice I can say is hang in there and keep doing what you are doing. We do the same form up discipline and there are days that I feel like it is a loosing battle. Good luck!