How Important Do You Think Being Chivalrous Is?

I certainly don't expect my husband to open all my doors for M. but he does a lot of times. . And it makes M. feel special when he does. He also tells M. every night at dinner "thank you for making dinner, it was great". Now if the dinner wasn't so delicious, he will still say thank you, and ask M. "so how did you make _____ this time, it was different" .

hmmmm....good question. I have mixed feelings about this because I think it is a form of showing respect towards women but then again I have seen some men going overboard or what makes M. feel like "geez, does he think I am incapable of doing anything by myself??" I like chivalry but there are times that I feel that it is over done too.

When I'm with my husband I never open doors, he J. automatically does it. And he always walks on the side of the sidewalk closest to the road (his mother told him that's what a good man does).
I think it's a respect thing, not a "women are weak so men have to do this thing".
We all should open doors for people in need, ie: the mom with a stroller, the old person with the walker, anyone with an arm full of stuff.
If I'm the one with the car keys and doing the driving I open the car door for my hubby. It's J. the nice thing to do and is a little, easy thing that J. shows you "care".

My husband doesnt open my car door, because hes usually putting all the kids in the car, I think I can open and close the car door myself. ;) But he does open all other doors for M.. He always puts M. first, he waits until I sit down before he starts eating. He is a gentleman, but its not extreme. Hes right where I want him to be. EXCEPT when he refers to M. as "her" when hes talking to someone. Does that bother anyone else? Like, "Im with HER today". Ummm, I have a name. I guess we cant have it all. :)

Historically, chivalry was one of the knightly virtues that dealt with honor on the battlefield. It is not chivalrous to strike a foe from behind, etc. What you refer to is simply courtesy and should not be made into something it's not.

Is it really courteous to open the car door for M. and close it when it's 104 degrees and I've been baked into a casserole in the time it takes you to get the air conditioning on?

In this day and age, our concepts need to be practical for the world we live in. Chivalry has nothing to do with a happy, successful relationship. Courtesy is expected in all human interaction, but only you can determine what values are most important to you for a relationship.

One of the dictionary definitions of "chivalrous" is: "a : marked by honor, generosity, and courtesy; b : marked by gracious courtesy and high-minded consideration, especially to women." So chivalry may go a little beyond what we usually think of as good manners, but it's a close cousin.

What are good manners? What we call etiquette is J. a code of conduct (or manners) toward others that is broken down into easy-to-remember rules. Basically, good manners are about thinking of other people besides oneself.

I was a young woman when it was suddenly deemed offensive and chauvinistic for a man to open a door for a woman. I thought it through, and decided that in my book it was certainly not offensive to open a door for anyone, regardless of gender. It also requires a warm "Thank you!" in return.

Chivalrous behavior is not the steak and potatoes of a relationship, but it's fine to have if you can get it.

When any sort of manners is used for impressing or charming others *instead* of caring about them, those manners are offensive in the long run. That applies to women as well as to men.

So you might want to look at the ways your SO shows that he cares and considers other people important, not only you/your daughter but also the stranger on the street. (There's an old saying that you reveal your quality by the manner in which you treat the people who can't benefit you in any way.)

AND... if he not only scores highly on that but also (maybe) shows a few traditional outward signs of chivalry - noticing when you walk into a room, opening a door for you, helping you with your coat, defending you from dragons - well, maybe there aren't any in your neighborhood - I bet you have a keeper. Show him your appreciation!

Haven't read the other answers yet...my husband is an opener of doors, a walker to the car, etc., and I love it. We've been married for 12 years and he still opens doors for M.. To M., it reminds M. of when we were first dating and he wanted to "make a good impression." It makes M. feel like he STILL wants to make a good impression and I like that! I know I can open my own door, sure. But I think it's a nice gesture and will be teaching my son the same (my father-in-law is the same way and no doubt taught my husband by example.) But I don't care about flowers. I am the breadwinner in the family so I don't want money wasted on a vase of flowers that will J. die anyway.

It's a nice touch - icing on the cake.
My husband and son both open doors for M. and are wonderful gentlemen.
It's especially nice because it's unasked for/not expected and they J. want to show they love and respect M..
But you are right, a snake in the grass can be J. as polite.
I think it says something about the man, but it's not a total measure of the kind of person they are - it's a piece, but not the whole puzzle.

I think perhaps a better barometer of how a man will treat you is not so much if he opens doors and brings flowers, but how he treats his own mother. That speaks volumes about character.
While my husband is certainly polite & chivalrous to a degree, I don't think you can define a man's character by O. trait or the lack of O. trait.
That's like asking "If a man picks his nose, will he be abusive?" or something like that. You J. can't connect the dots to a real conclusion.
And, considering your ex, I think you answered your own question! LOL
BE PICKY! It's ALL in the choosing!

There is no clear cut answer to this, imo. Lots of "chivalrous" guys are doing that to get their way. But other guys who don't open doors are wonderful guys (my dad never opens my mom's door, or buys her flowers except for a small handful of times in their 40+ years of marriage, but he is her "rock" through a lot of physical problems).

I think you need to look at the overall picture: Does the guy treat you/your daughter with respect? Do he take into consideration her feelings, thoughts, etc., and value her as a person. If he's chivalrous, it can be a cover, or it can his basing his action on a stereotype of women that is wrong.....

My DH doesn't buy my flowers, or open my door (unless I'm carrying something or whatever). When we travel, he always drives, because he feels like that is his job. He always unloads the car after grocery shopping, or carries the laundry downstairs for M., or will get stuff off the high shelves (I'm short, he's tall; we have a running joke that he is the super hero "Tall Man!", so I will call out in a high pitched girly voice "Tall Man, I need help!" :). He has always treated M. with respect, even when we dated and went to dutch on dates. He is definitely somewhat protective of M., but realizes that I am a capable, valuable person.

I am lucky, for the most part. My husband is very "chivalrous". lol
-He opens doors for M. (not car doors) and continues to hold them if someone is behind M.. He will even hold the door while he is holding the baby in her carseat.
-He ALWAYS carries the baby when she is in her carseat. She's heavy! I do it when he's not arround, but it's nice that he does it.
-He always paid for dinner, lunch, or any excursion before we got married. He HATES it when he can see people going dutch, or going to a restaurant and he can see them split the bill. I mean, it really annoys him. He paid for everything, even when we were J. friends.
-When we are walking he always walks on the outside..near the road.
There are others, but those are the first that come to mind. It may have been his upbringing (he is Mexican)...but then again it may J. be that he loves and respects M. enough to show it through his actions. I am his "lady"....he feels the need to protect and help M.. And believe M....I am NOT helpless at all. But it's nice to feel like I am being taken care of.
CHivalry is not dead in my marriage!
L.

I think chivalry is a way to show someone "I respect you and don't take you for granted". It says, " I want to make a good impression on you." But a J. because someone is chivalrous doesn't mean he is a good person or a committed person. Those clues come down the line with careful observation. Personally I think chivalry is a nice way to start a relationship and shows that the person you are interested in has good intentions and at least a rudimentary understanding of how to treat people with respect. Its only time that will tell if these actions are at the core of his being or if he's putting on a good show.
Hope this helps. I am 12 years into a marriage with a good man who used to be outwardly chivalrous. That has faded now but I know from less romantic gestures (taking out the trash, ironing his own shirts, taking the kids outside to play) that the feeling remains the same.

Chivalry isn't important - common courtesy is.
Does he open doors for M. ? Sure. And I open them for him as well.
Does he bring M. flowers? Sometimes. And I sometimes bring him flowers.

What ever is important to the two of you as a couple is what is important.

When I was younger I was a big macho chick and got mad when a guy would offer to hold open a door and all that thinking I was a big independent girl who didn't need a man, especially to open a door when I'm quite capable. I thought it made M. seem weak if the door was opened for M..

Later in life, especially after living in the south, I found that it had nothing to do with weakness, capability or anything like that. It had to do with respect. My husband stopped opening the door for M. early in our relationship and had done it in years. Then as I got older and realized what it really meant to M. I got made because he never opened the door for M. and didn't do other things. LOL So he was confused, we talked and now he opens the door for M., especially when the occasion calls for it like when we're going out to dinner. It's about respect. The little things matter.

As for going out to dinner, he "pays the bill". We have one account and all money goes there no matter who it's from but he's the one who pulls out the card and "pays". To him it's a husband thing or a dad thing when we're out as a family. That doesn't mean that I don't pull out my card and "pay" sometimes, like when he's in the bathroom when the bill comes. I don't wait for him to come back and have him "pay". That would be a waste of time. But we never pay "dutch" because all money is in one account. But when we were dating my husband would usually pay the bill because he asked M.. We had it figured back then that who ever is doing the asking out to dinner would pay, or to the movies or whatever. We were dating so we'd take turns on paying, even though my husband thought he should pay most times but at one point I made more than him so that wouldn't work.

Chivalrous guys aren't "better" but I would like to think that they have more respect for you if they at least offer in the beginning, and then the two of you would work out what you both prefer as the relationship progresses.

In the end, it boils down to what is important to the both of you as a couple. But if you're on a date, why not let him open the door for you? Why not come home once in a why with some flowers J. because he was thinking of you? Be sure not to compare your previous relationships with your present life. J. because your ex was courteous but cheated, the two are not connected. He was courteous, great. He cheated, not so great. Two different things.

K. B
mom to 5 including triplets

I don't care about doors and all that too much. Sometimes my hubby opens doors, sometimes not. Usually now it is whoever has a free hand with two kids and one on the way!! :P The funny thing is when we were dating he did not open doors and all that on purpose. He said it wasn't that he didn't want to do nice things he J. didn't want to create this picture that he was some kind of perfect guy and then if we did end up together I would be disappointed when I found out he was J. a regular dude. I respected that, you know. He didn't want to try an impress M., but J. wanted us to get to know each other for real. But what he did do was if he said he was going to call, he called. If he said he would be somewhere at a certain time, he was there. He called M. everyday and never wanted to get off the phone. He never had something better to do than spend time with M.. That is what showed M. the kind of man he was, and he is still that man 5.5 yrs later. I am number one on his list. So I think it is all about what is important to you. He does show up with flowers J. because, and I love that. But what I love more is when he says he is going to fix the fence, he does it, I don't have to worry about nagging. I think a man that is generous and keeps his word is the sexiest thing on the planet, anybody can open a door :D That's J. M.! Good question ;)

I think it's nice, but on the other hand, it's something we should do for each other, not because I'm a woman. So, sometimes I open the door and hold it for him, and sometimes he does it for M.. It often comes down to who gets there first, or who had a free hand. And now, our older children do it. My 9yo son opens and holds the door for M. and his younger siblings (ok, when he remembers... he is 9 after all) and my 6yo daughter ALWAYS keeps the door of elevators open until she's sure that everyone who needs to has either come in or out -- it's really cute, she stands as far out of the way as she can manage and sticks her arm in front of the door to keep it from closing. For everyone. I think that this is really what chivalry is about -- it's not taking care of the woman -- it's everyone treating everyone else with respect and taking care of each other. And yes, THAT is very important.

Chivalry is NOT dead... neither are MANNERS and being polite in general. I'm not saying my guy has to open EVERY door or pull out my chair every time, but once in a while it's nice being put on that pedestal and rewarded and appreciated for everything I do on a daily basis.

Ditto for women. If your man is sweet enough to open your car door, reach over and pop the lock for him so HE can get in.

It J. goes back to being courteous to each other, and it's the little things that go a long way. It shows that you're making an effort. I will absolutely be raising my kids, daughters and son, the art of chivalry :)

Like you said, being chivalrous won't automatically guarantee a person has morals and will be faithful. BUT. Neither does being a rude slacker guy who lets his wife drag her own heavy suitcase through the airport.

Character is important, and so is chivalry. There are some "good guys" who J. didn't happen to be taught to be chivalrous by their parents, and it's not their fault, and they're good in every other way, even though they don't help lug in the groceries or open doors for people, and they J. cant' get the hang of it. But more often, a guy who does not want to go the extra mile to behave like a strong thoughtful man with a few extra gestures that TAKE EFFORT is probably not a stellar human being.

I grew up very poor. My dad was a good man, but we were humble types and I never saw "chivalry" modeled. I was raised with the, "money doesn't matter, it's what's on the inside that counts" type thing. Which is true in a lot of ways. But off I went into the big bad world, not holding it against guys if they were broke and lacked manners because I was a "nice person".

Suffice it to say, that 20 years later, after living in Los Angeles and NYC and dating into my mid 30's, I am teaching my daughters to RUN, not walk away from men who don't have chivalry. My son knows how to open doors and treat ladies well, and he's only 3.

My daughters are having the advice I never got: You do NOT want a man who is too weak and thoughtless to open a door for you or lift a bag, because over time you will see the sky is the limit on what he will NOT do for you. And you do NOT want a guy who is not willing and able to care for a family financially, it doesn't make you a gold digger to want someone to take care of you, while you are taking care of him. And to my son I say he should WANT to be the leader and care taker.

These are not things I would have thought were true 20 years ago.

My husband and I don't have a lot of money, and I've always worked and that's OK, but I've learned a lot about people over the years, and the struggles we're having right now with no health insurance while I'm home full time with the kids for my first break EVER have shown M. where I could have had some different priorites when I was younger. But that's OK. I have whipped him into modeling as much chivalry as his Texas genes can muster for the sake of the kids, and I'm trying to teach what I have learned to my kids. My blood still boils when we're home visiting his parents and his step dad is ordering before everyone in restaurants and letting M. drag heavy high chairs across the room while pregnant. But. my husband has improved a lot with much prodding.

My kids were star struck by my husband the other week when he stopped our car in the rain to jump out and help an older lady who was struggling to get into a door at the gas station. Yes, I pinched him and nudged him and pointed because he didn't notice her, but the lesson was still taught and he got to feel proud for being a good man while the kids ooh'ed and ahhh'ed about their nice dad. Chivalry matters. It's really sad that the social norms have sunk so low that it's almost extinct.

I will tell you the day I KNEW my now husband was going to be my husband. While we were dating we went to the grocery store together. I lived on the second floor walk up condo. I brought in what I could, and had to pee. When I came out - ALL the groceries were in the house and he was busy putting everything away. It made M. feel good and it still does and I love him for it! You know, its the little things :)

Chivalry is not about bringing flowers home, and not about paying for dinner, and not about holding doors open.

It is not about men being superior, or women being weaker physically, or impressing someone.

Chivalry is (dictionary definition) "Courtesy towards women; the combination of qualities expected of an ideal knight, esp courage, honor, justice, and a readiness to help the weak; courteous behavior, esp towards women".

Chivalry is J. the outward expression of the inner respect a man has for women. To M., chivalry is extremely important. Not because I can't open my own door, and not because I couldn't pay for my own meals when we dated, but because it shows that a man respects and honors women.

We are teaching our sons to be chivalrous, and our daughters to expect chivalry. We are also teaching them that women are NOT weak, even if they aren't as strong as men. We are teaching them to respect and be respected. My 11 year old son insists on holding the door for M. if Daddy isn't there, and my 14 year old son goes to the grocery store with an elderly neighbor lady every week to help her. My 7 year old helps girls on the playground who get hurt, and stands up for anyone who is being bullied.

These are the values I want to teach my children, and the best way to teach is for them to see it in action.

That said, I don't stand around waiting for doors to be opened for M. or any of that. If hubby's there, he opens them. If he's getting the kids out of the car and I get to the door first, I open it. Most often, though, he'll even jog so he gets to the door first.

I also know of a couple who insisted they were going to make "chivalrous men of their son" and that they were going to "bring chivalry back big". The husband never respected his wife. He talked a big game, and he'd hold doors; but only when someone was around to see him. That was not true chivalry; true chivalry is done because it is the right thing to do.

My two cents.

Chivalry is important to M. and I do appreciate it a lot in a man. It's all in the attention to the little things...generally the men who are chivalrous are also well mannered and more elegant in their ways. I love that. There's a certain sense of pride in a man doing nice little things for his lady, like she is his diamond, his most precious belonging. I know a couple (they are in their 70s) and the husband is (and as always been) chivalrous to the wife...she told M. this trait of his helped a great deal in dealing with issues/disagrements etc during married life because he always made sure not to be offensive or disrispectful while quarreling with his wife. And they DID fight quite a bit in their long, happy marriage, as all couples do. SO I completely disagree with the people who say that formality has no substance. I'd rather have a chivalrous, imperfect man, than an indifferent, imperfect man.

Hi, Jen:

Thanks for asking this question. Since I have been in Pennsylvania,
I have had more fellas holding the door open for M. or open the door for M. than I ever had before in my life.

The way I look at it: I consider it good home training. J. because a fella opens the door for M., I don't think he wants to marry M. or have a relationship with M..

J. because a fella has good manners doesn't mean he will have good morals.

J. a thought.
Thanks for the question.
D.

Important? Maybe not. Nice to do? Definitely. And my husband is courteous, polite and considerate (chivalry conjures up images of knights and jousting to M., for some reason...hahaha). Hopefully our 3 daughters will notice this and realize that, "hey, THIS is how a man should treat a woman!" and not settle for less once they start dating.

You know.....in our day to day life, not so much. Like if we've all been outside playing, he's not running up ahead of M. to open the door LOL! But on special occasions, dates, family Christmas parties, work gathering etc, he is. Maybe only when I'm wearing nice clothes? :)

Does taking out the trash "for M." count?

I think it is important. My husband usually opens doors for M., daughter, mother, and so on. Hardly ever the car door, but he never did that while we were dating so I knew that from the start. My father-in-law is more chivalrous then my hubby, he opens & closes car doors for M.. The funny thing is my mother-in-law usually ask him to do so if he does not do it for her, and I rarely her say thanks/ I never ask, not polite & really I never think someone else needs to open it for M. unless my hands are full. I always say thanks andthe smiles I usually get back are so caring and thankful for a thanks.

In the end I teach being polite instead of being chivalrous, no matter if male or female you open doors for others (not car doors unless hands are full) or other helpful nice gestures.

I love getting flowers, of course I usually buy them for myself if I need the pick-M.-up. For M. it really is more important how you always act not J. the person trying to be chivalrous to look good (a selfious person will use chivalrous gestures to win someone over but it is not who they are all the time).

I think chivalry is important because it -can be - indicative of courtesy and consideration which is worth its weight in gold once you're into the "daily grind" together.

I know that some men stop these gestures once they're married, thinking they don't have to do any work now that the "chase" is over, so I would say that everyday attempts/efforts to show consideration by helping with kids, giving mom a break, help w/cleaning, etc go a lot farther because they say that he views himself as a partner in your family life.

I think chivalry is J. a certain brand of thoughtfulness. Honestly, I don't need it. Too much waiting around for M., for guys who feel like they have to open my door. Whoever gets to the door first and has a free hand can open it.
Think about the kind of life you want, and the kind of person who will be a partner to you and a father to your daughter. Don't worry about what friends think. The right man might be an unexpected combination of things--chivalry might be one of those things--but don't let it be a deal breaker if the other things are good. You're smart to think about what a man is like through your daughter's eyes.

It's a way to show respect.
We teach our sons to open doors for M. and their sisters. I wait for them to do it, not the car door though, I am usually getting things in the car.
My hubby brings home flowers whenever he sees that they are spent, dead, or I have cleaned the old ones up. He usually gives them to my one son at home to give to M..
He teaches my sons to stand so that a woman or older gentleman may sit in a waitng area of a restaurant, or wherever.
He buys dinners at fast food restaurants for older retired military, people have bought him many meals when he was in uniform.
He says Yes Ma'am and yes Sir to anyone who is older or has a more senior position than he and teaches my children to do the same.

People notice. My children are always being complimented on how polite they are. I am told often how pleasant they are to have around. It's all about being nice. THere is so much unkindness, uncaring, negativity nowadays that J. plain good manners is a breath of fresh air.