Natural Consequences - Eureka,CA

It is a skill he will learn much faster when he isn't resentful at someone and that energy being directed at them is not going to processing his environment....let me see if I can say that differently.

If he is focused on a person and his brain is not able to move on he is not processing what he needs to learn from the experience. He is not able to.

I would say hubby needs to back off and let him learn on his own. If it runs out it is out, no reminders, nothing. I am a helicopter parent and know from experience the more I let the kids go the more they learn.

I have a son with similar issues and at the VERY first sign he's not taking care of something the item goes into "time out" until he's in a good place and can have it back. I got tired of the fight....I've done this with his bike, anything. It works for us....

One of the toughest aspects of ADD/ADHD is that the child (or adult) does not automatically connect "natural consequences" because very often they occur in the distant future. One of the hallmarks of ADD is the inability to "on-the-spot" identify "what will happen if...". They simply cannot do it without being forced to stop and think.

Two additional thoughts:
1. "Expected" is not the same as "accepted". Not all 11 year old boys are irresponsible and having an "it's okay b/c..." mindset won't help your son in the long-run.
2. Try a more direct behavior approach with him. Reminders won't work- never do for ADD kids. Their brains switch channels way too fast and he won't follow through. Instead try a SODA method. When I was working as a school psychologist, this technique worked well.

Rather than reminding him to bring something in, take 5 minutes and have him:
Stop- have him stop what he is doing and look at you while you are talking.
Observe- ask him to tell you where his air gun is right now and why it is there; ask him what will happen if it stays there.
Decide- Ask him what he thinks he should do about the gun
Act- go do it and come back to me when you have done it

This allows you to have him stop and process the "natural consequence" and make a conscious decision to avoid it. Otherwise you are assuming that he's connecting those two things- he probably isn't!

I agree with your approach about how if he breaks something than its on him to replace it, but I can also see your hubby's point in what is the point of getting him nice things if he is not going to care for them. That would frustrate me also. I personally would probably only buy him things on sale or off craigslist so that when he did damage, ruin, or lose things that I purchased I wouldn't be out so much money.

As for him letting his friends use up his BB's, as long as he's the one buying the replacements, more power to him. If he was expecting me to keep buying more, I would say no.

As for him having a BB gun, a gun is a gun and gun safety still applies. It can cause injury, so I would not let him leave it outside, get messed with, etc. He needs to be supervised when firing it, and when he's done, it needs to be locked in a gun cabinet. How will he feel, you feel if a neighbor or young child were to find the gun laying around outside and get injured? You yourself could probably face some charges for failure to secure the gun. Not a lecture, just an observation.

Natural consequences are the way to go. Even with ADD, he has to learn how to deal with it. He has to live with this for a long time. Natural consequences are the best teacher. It hurts sometimes, but I think you are making the right decision.

It sounds like he isn't responsible enough to own the air soft gun. I wouldn't have allowed him to purchase it in the first place, but now that he has it, I would take it away. Owning a gun, even an air soft gun, is a serious responsibility and he doesn't seem to be able to make the good choices required to own and use one.

Kidz are kidz are kidz are kidz...without the ADD they lose, break, loan & leave things unattended naturally...consequences to his/their actions is the ONLY way they learn!

I love that you don't want to ride your son on this. In my opinion, your stance that if he's old enough to have the bb gun, he should take care of it is spot on.

There is a great book "How to Talk So Kids Will Listen...and how to Listen So Kids Will Talk" (by Faber and Mazlish-- it's on my must-read list for parents). I'd highly recommend checking this book out from the library and sharing it with your husband. There are comic panels in it to illustrate different communication techniques (so you aren't asking him to sit down and read chapters...guys seem to be allergic to this!) . There's one panel in particular that addresses carelessness with belongings.

Another way to look at it (and maybe your husband would consider this) is to figure out "whose" problem a potentially-ruined/stolen bb gun would be. If everyone else is reminding him to take care of the toy, then it's becoming the problem of others.

Another natural consequence is just to just decide for yourself that if he leaves it out, you will put it away for a while. In our house, if a toy becomes a problem, it goes away for a while. In short-- if you are making it MY problem, then it goes away until we've come up with a plan.

Lastly, like the book will describe, enlist your son in creating a plan for taking care of his bb gun. If he's the 'author' of it, the plan has a better chance of working. Give it a week or two, and then see if the plan is effective or needs to be changed.

I think you and your husband will be right about "natural consequences".

Blessings....

I just wanted to support you and say that by making him earn the money to replace the items, you are doing the right thing. If your son has ADD, normal consequences don't work on his brain. Please, I beg you to have your husband listen to the CDs from Love & Logic called "Calming the Chaos: Behavior Improvement Strategies for the Child with ADD/ADHD"

You can get it here: Behavior Improvement Strategies for the Child with ADD/ADHD

I listened to it a little at a time in the car on my way to work, and it comes from a place of love with your child, explains wonderfully why normal discipline doesn't work with ADD kids, and has concrete suggestions about what will work. It might just change your husband's way of thinking about your son.

I have to say that I will agree with your husband, especially if your child has ADD. He may not be able to anticipate a natural consequence (out of sight, out of mind) once he has moved on to another object or task (like leaving the BB gun outside and moving on to the next toy).
But I think that it is true for ANY child, ADD or not that some skills are better learned if we make it a good habit... and you can only make things a good habit if you do them regularly and make your kids do the same thing every time until it becomes, well a habit.
My mom never made cleaning up after myself and putting things were they belong when done with them a good habit for us. She thought like you, that we would learn to take care of things if they broke... well neither my sis nor I ever really LEARNED to clean up after ourselves and let me tell you, as young adults living with roommates, it was a constant struggle! I have had to learn the hard way as an adult and I still struggle with some aspects of it today. For example I can never find anything in my office, because I have a hard time putting things "where they belong". And I am not ADD, I just never learned to make it a good habit.
With my DD I am making sure she learns these things early and she's not allowed to move on to the next toy, before the previous one is safely back in it's place. This keeps the toys from getting trashed, broken or lost and will be a good habit for her with pretty much anything, from toys to homework to the workplace someday.

I don't think you need to nag him all the time, but you may want to give him a little more guidance than just reminding him, like making him put things back in their place before moving on, not allowing him to lend things to friends without you permission...

I am not the one to ask-maybe take it away for a couple of weeks-then try again??? Make it a set, realistic time.

Sounds like my son! (airsoft gun included!) My son also has ADD and is very distracted. he doesn't leave his guns outside - but he does leave his bicycle outside all the time in all kinds of weather. his reason is that the bike is getting to small for him anyway and he won't be suing it for much longer. It still makes me and my husband crazy.

It's a really tough dilemma - becuase our kids have so much - they are spoiled - even if they buy the toy with their own money - it's only becuase they have the luxury of using their money only for extras and not neccessitites. Only a generation or two ago it was not uncommon for kids to contribute to the household beucase the family needed every dime.

I really don't have any advice for you - I'm just commiserating. Unless the kids have to spend their own time and effort replacing their own stuff they won't really appreciate it - but it's something they need to learn themselves - as tough as it it for us to watch...

We're all about natural consequences in our home with our sons (7 and 14), and it works very well, but neither of our boys have ADD. I don't have any experience with children with ADD and using natural consequences. I do think you and your husband need to talk and decide how you're going to handle discipline because for any type of discipline to work, you need to be consistent. You and your husband need to be on the same page. Perhaps you could figure out some sort of compromise??? Good luck. :)

I think the natural consequences are not working. As you said, it doesn't seem to bother him. There are many examples of this. I have to agree with your husband on this.

No problem with air soft guns here.

I think it should be a mixed approach, because when your child isn't skilled at something (remembering about taking care of his stuff) you should help him out.

So, when you think of it, you say, "Did you remember to bring in your air soft gun?" When you don't help him and something gets lost or ruined, then the natural consequences kick in. You don't replace the item and he has to live without it. But you don't get mad about it, because it's his consequence. Slightly annoyed, maybe.

Boys tend to be less careful about their belongings than girls, and your son's story is pretty common, in my experience.

Look at the good side -- your son is not greedy and super caught up with possessions. That does have a positive side to it.

Reading other responses: My oldest was more like that, and I don't agree with taking a total natural consequences approach, because all or most of his stuff will just get ruined that way. Some people, old and young, are NEVER particularly good at taking care of stuff -- lose it, break it, whatever. So I think helping him out is fine - just not replacing it.