Newly Engaged and Already Have Problems with the Sister-in-law

So sorry. I have to tell you that I wouldn't get married into this family. Again, I'm so sorry.

Dawn

Gonna be a looooong engagement.
I'm sorry. Not to be snarky but I couldn't take that kind if family drama.
Good luck.

Didn't you say in the beginning of this that she was married and had a baby?? Where is her husband in all of this??

You are marrying a guy that has a family, they will become YOUR family too-- not your competition.
That, my dear, is what you need to realize.

Wow, this has classic birth order issues all over it. She is totally the spoiled, rotten baby of the family, where she is accustomed to getting her way in everything. And if she doesn't she whines, like a baby does, but now she can use adult body language and voice, to get what she wants.

I soooooo understand this, because I was exactly like your fiance. I was forced to raise my youngest sister and for years I put her needs/wants above my very own. I did not even know any different or better. And we don't do better unless we know better. It was 'my job' to take care of her, and on and on it went.

Therapy helped me get it. So did reading a birth order book. Forget which one, but there are many.

I really see this as potentially fixable, as they are just acting out their age appropriate birth order. I imagine the other sibs tend to her in some way or another.

I can't for the life of me figure out why she would ask her brother to pick her up. Does she not drive? Why? And he's in school? Someone needs to tell her there are only so many hours in a day and they don't revolve around her.

Sorry, but until you get your fiance to see the pattern, and he's probably glad you do, and he's willing to openly admit that there is less than balanced approach to his sibling relationship, you're doomed to many more sarcastic knocks.

GL!

oh dear.
two drama queens in the same family.
doesn't bode well.
khairete
S.

H.,

First, I couldn't make it through your post. 2/3s of the way through, this is what occurred to me:

Like most couples who are serious about getting married, you and your fiance should attend some sort of premarital counseling. You both need to get on the same page about how you both feel regarding situations like these and how you want to handle them in the future. If you have been on this forum for a while, you likely know that annoying family members never go away and often only become more divisive. You need to take care of your marriage *before* you get married, if you know what I mean.

Marriage is TOUGH. I don't want to be mean, but let's play devil's advocate here. Your SIL is a problem, true, but if you are so disgusted right now that you don't want to even see him-- what's going to happen if she's injured and wants more help from him? Or what if one of your parents or his needs care? Raising kids is equally rife with conflict. This is only the beginning....

If you can't express yourselves to each other now, honestly and respectfully, there's no way you will have a happy, healthy marriage going forward.

Listen, I have been there. I swallowed up a lot of resentments and inequalities in family relationships with my ex-husband BEFORE we married, figuring it would change once we were married. It didn't. Instead, the frustrations and anger became more profound. My (now) husband and I, this time around, did the work before making a lifetime commitment to each other. It didn't mean that we agreed with each other about everything, but we learned that we agreed far more than we disagreed, we learned to be honest--even when it was hard, and we learned how to 'fight fair'. We learned how to listen to each others needs. Through some very hard times, this groundwork has kept us together.

Think of this as the foundation you build the house of your marriage on. Premarital counseling will help you both find common ground, help him to understand your feelings, help you to see his perspective (even if you don't like it). He *does* need to have a conversation with his sister about her disrespect and rudeness, but if *you* were in her situation, would you want to be called out in front of someone else or otherwise put in your place? She sounds very insecure and immature. I imagine she thought you'd be a fun 'third' with she and her brother, and didn't expect what she's getting.

Go talk to a counselor, before you end up married to someone you end up not respecting. Better to know now than later.

You don't want to say anything because that will put your fiance in the middle. He IS in the middle. You need to talk to him about how you are feeling. You need to clear the air with the SIL. If you aren't feeling comfortable/happy now, it will NOT get better after the wedding.

You are only engaged.
Not married.
Get out.
This is only the beginning of DEEP troubles.
And it will get worse.

You don't have to be engaged.
Find a better guy and normal family.

CHOOSE your own life.
Why be a doormat for your Fiance and his family and all the drama and deep TOXIC trouble they cause?

Get out.
Just because you are engaged, it does not mean you have to marry him or ever.

I would never have a boyfriend like that.
I would never have a Fiance like that.
I would never marry a guy like that.
I would not knowingly marry a guy who has a family like that.
I would not even be engaged to him.
You must've known this is how he is and how his family is, before you even got engaged.
Why even be, engaged. To. him.

1) Men in general REALLY don't think the way women do. 1 will get you 100 he's not defending you because he doesn't see verbal banter as an attack. With men, attacks are physical or financial. With women, attacks are verbal & social. He sees her bantering with you, not attacking you.

2) He's not a mind reader. You CANNOT assume he knows what's hurting/bothering you.

3) Solutions: She's NOT something you can control, but you can control you.
- If she annoys you, stay home. DONT make him choose without telling him (aka don't set him up to "betray" you by "choosing wrong". Send them out on their own, and have times where you & Beaux are on you own.
- Only include her in things you can tolerate her in/at, instead of BFF things
- Change the venue. When you're together, make it a place you can hug/kiss/great to see you/time for me to go!

H., you are learning ahead of time that marrying the love of your life means living the rest of your life with their family, whether you like it or not. It's not easy, even when everyone gets along, because you grew up with different experiences, behaviors & personalities than they did. So what is mild to you is frickin' annoying to them, & vice versa.

That said, I think you really do love your fiance & want to do what is best for the two of you, which seems to be whatever necessary to keep the peace. Since that is not your personality by nature, but you recognize that "being yourself" is not beneficial for good relationships, it is definitely putting a strain on you, which is coming through in your connection with your fiance.

One thing I have learned (the hard way!) is that men truly DO NOT communicate & "read" situations the same way that women do. Take a few minutes to watch this video from the Laugh your Way to a Better Marriage http://www.google.com/search?q=a+tale+of+two+brains+video... (note: this is one segment of a complete seminar, I believe you can find all the parts on YouTube)

So, when you have been talking to your fiance, chances are you talk to him in a way that your girlfriends would TOTALLY understand. They'd be on the same page as you, willing to do whatever it takes to make things better between you & their sister.

However, your fiance is not hearing what you say, the way you say it & most importantly, the way you MEAN it. What I have learned over the course of many years is that when I need to have my husband HEAR me & UNDERSTAND me, I have to take the emotions out of it. Talking to him immediately before/during/after a situation will do no more than have him go "oh, OK, I'll do something about that". The End.

But, when I can find a different time to talk with him, & I have thought through what is bothering me, WHY it's bothering me, & what would make it NOT bother me, I find that mutual purpose is more often than not achieved. He can be engaged in the conversation, and become part of the solution.

Men like to fix things. But when it comes to 'fixing' family, they struggle. I know my husband "reverts" back to his childhood self when we are with his family for any length of time. Drives me nuts!! So we have had some engaged conversations, & discussed 1 or 2 key behaviors that I've asked for his help on. We've agreed what they are & how he will respond. That way, going forward, I know we are on the same page.

And in the event that he forgets his part, I'll give him a nod or a nudge to remind him, or if it's not critical @ that time, talk to him afterwards & say "honey, tonight your mom made some really snarky comments about the dinner I made tonight. I felt left in the dust when you didn't speak up & support the effort I made"

Every relationship is different, & I'm sure you & your fiance will find your own communication dynamic. I think it's important to figure out what really is bothering you about your SIL (to be) behavior. Maybe it's what she's actually doing, & maybe it's more because you don't like the way it make you feel, & you are recognizing that you are being petty (I am NOT saying that you are, but I have found myself getting upset only to realize that the reason I'm upset is because I wanted to be in control of something, & it's really petty of me to want that & let it get to me, & so I am actually more upset with myself).

Once you know why you are upset, make sure to relate it beyond the immediate moment. Obviously it's hard when you aren't married yet, not living together, he's in classes, both of you working... so what's going to happen in 2 years? How will your SIL behavior be an issue then? In other words, get to the root of the behavior & the problem you have with it, instead of why it's a problem "right now".

So, take-aways -
1. Why are you upset? How do you need things to be different? What compromises can you make?
2. Communicate with your fiance so that he hears you & is engaged in the discussion.
3. Include your fiance as part of the solution - get his "buy in"

I'll add one final thing - Take some time to think about what YOU can do towards your SIL to help change the relationship into something better. It may take a lot of time (more than 1 year) but even a small change towards a better relationship can be fostered & grow over time, & marriage is for a lifetime.

T.

Edited to Add:
Just saw your SWH: You comment that you don't understand how your fiance can be oblivious to what you see going on. But honey, he's lived with her his entire life - this may not be anything new. Even if it is - every person views things differently (just ask a cop who took a statement from 10 different people about the same incident!).

So you are viewing it one way, because of who you are, & he is viewing it a different way, because of who he is. Then you make it about someone he is closely related to, & how he views it will be even different than if she were a stranger & he was watching from the outside.

It sounds like you are in a "funky" place right now about everything going on & who your SIL is as a person. Your SWH has a very negative tone to it as you refer to her. I would urge you to think of a list of positive things about her, & focus on those. Perhaps also enlist someone to help you learn how to change your focus to one of positives.

Not that she will all of a sudden become peaches & cream in your eyes by doing that, but when you only think of the negative things, it tends to cloud our ability to see the person beyond what we are projecting onto them.
A mentor, church clergy or even someone through an employee assistance program @ your work (check with HR) would be a good place to start for help in understanding this.

Your fiance needs to deal with his sister.

You're not going to want to hear this, but you need to postpone your wedding plans. If you don't feel like you can talk to your fiance, that is a huge red flag that the two of you are not yet at a point to be married. It is anther red flag he doesn't automatically put your first.

You need to start a marriage the way you mean for it to continue, so if you marry while these problems exist, it will only get worse and you'll be doomed before you start.

The two of you should get into couples/premarital counseling. Don't even set a date at this point, you're not even close to being ready.

When I was reading your story I thought it was me that wrote this. You should look at some of things I asked on this site before. The only difference is that I married the guy. I love my daughter more than anything and I love my husband. But he's quiet and is working on defending us when need be. I decided to give him another chance because of our baby. I'm not saying break up with your fiancé. But think long and hard before you decide to marry this man and have a baby with him. It's much harder to leave later than it would be now. He needs to stand up for you. And you need to stand up for yourself. I would try speaking your mind next time and see what your fiancé does. Maybe you'll be surprised or maybe you'll get hurt. But you stuck up for yourself and that's what needs to happen.

My mother in law and sister in law are the most manipulative people I have ever met. Are you sure their not related:)? It took my husband a long time to realize that if his lack of standing up for me happens again that I'm done. My mother in law tries to smoke around my child. Last time I flipped out, my husband said nothing. This past week it happened again, first I said something and then my husband yelled at her. I'm still not sure if he will be able to back me up with his family. Ill have to wait and see and make my decision when the time comes. It was a baby step I guess.

My point is that if your already seeing problems now then you need to address them so you don't waste your time. I'm 25 like you and I made a mistake getting married when there were so many red flags. Be smart about this and don't settle for future problems. You deserve to come first.

If he doesn't open his eyes then you need to close the door. You deserve better. Don't make the same mistake as me.

I agree that you are not ready to get married and that you should let him deal with his sister.

I have to add: Aren't you two friends? Why are you acting like you just met her? Why is it so hard to say, "Uh, what are you doing?" when she starts being a brat in front of you? You can't control the relationship that she has with her brother, but if you can't express your feelings to him and reasonably expect him to consider you first, then you should probably not even be engaged yet.

She's jealous that her big brother has a new love and that she is no longer first. I think that most women have at least one man each who thinks the world of them, who pretty much puts them on pedestals and strokes their egos. Everyone needs a number one fan. You are taking hers away from her. Get some counseling and discuss how to set boundaries around your relationship.

Break the engagement and move across the country and start a new life....And honestly, you sound like a 16 year old and not at all prepared for marriage. Here's a clue....you don't just marry a man...or a woman...they come with a family. In your case it seems to be a sister....consider yourself lucky that it isn't his MOTHER.

People can easily DIVORCE their spouse, MOTHERS, FATHERS, SISTERS, BROTHERS, ETC. are forever. Guess what, YOU are the THIRD wheel.

I think this is the way this family functions. They will not change. This is their m.o. It's good you got an up front view of this before you got married. I don't think all is lost but unless your fiancé can see your feelings are more hurt than he thinks, this will continue. You could make a stink and things could change but not without feelings being hurt and resentment happening. You would still have to be her sil. Do you have brothers and sisters? They talk. Her talking to her bro about your feelings being hurt sounds normal. You are being a bit sensitive about that.

How much are you willing to compromise and put up with? That's what marriage is all about. Maybe both of you are not ready.

I want to adamantly disagree with a post below- You are NOT the third wheel!!!!! Absolutely not! Your fiance chose you to be his wife and that means turning his full attention away from his family and on to you.

Being married doesn't mean shunning family, but your fiance is being manipulated by his sister because of her jealousy and pettiness. If he doesn't realize this and stand his ground against her, then your marriage will be filled with stress. It won't get better unless it's dealt with.

To reiterate, you are NOT a third wheel and someone easily divorced. Don't reduce yourself to nothing based on someone else's words.

He needs to be married to you---Not her !

Things are backwards!

Attend premarital counseling and see if this matter will change.

Rigt now, you don't even want to see your fiance. If you get married---This will not be an option.

You don't want to see her and you don't want to see him........If you do not go to counseling w/ him.....Then, you might have to sit them down on the couch and stand in front of them (stand up / do not sit) and spill your gutts.

Unless she lives in another state---I can't see this continuing unless something changes !

Do not subject yourself to this !

What do you do? Seriously reconsider marrying this man. Is this really how you want to spend the rest of your life? It doesn't sound like he's capable of putting you above her, as he should once you're married.

Welcome to Mamapedia!

Have you talked to him about this? And I'm confused about how she introduced you two, but you didn't seem to be friends with her prior.

I urge you to talk this over with your fiance. I suggest that it would be helpful for the two of you to come up with boundaries in the way both of you relate with his sister. For example would it be possible that he would agree to not go and pick her up and that she doesn't spend much time with the two of you? Have this discussion away from her and when she's not asking for something.

Be calm and reasonable when you talk with him. Do not complain or whine. Just tell him that you want more time with him and feel that his sister intrudes are your time together. Listen to his way of thinking on the matter. Be as matter of fact and rational as you can be. Take the strong emotion that has built up because you've been not saying anything up until now out of it. If you come off as cranky and upset with his sister he may feel the need to defend her.

As for how to respond to her. Just nod and say, I hear you or I'll consider that or ah huh or anything that indicates you heard her but do not take what she says into your mind. Do not take her comments personally. Don't defend or explain yourself even to yourself. Know that you're happy with the way you are, that you and your fiance will plan your wedding, that you are in fact in charge of your life. What she thinks and says is not important.

I just saw that you're disgusted by your fiance. Huh? You haven't told him how you feel. It's not fair to expect him to kow what you need to hear from him. I suggest that you start out first with working on your relationship with him. Find a way to love him in spite of his sister. Trust that he will want to take care of you and the way you're feeling if he knows what you need. Be willing to consider what he needs and work out a way of handling his sister that works for both of you.

Telling him how you feel about his sister and what you need while being willing to discuss it with him to find a way that works for both of you is NOT putting him in the middle. It's uniting the two of you to deal with a mutual problem.

Get rid of your anger at him first because if you approach this with him in an angry, accusatory manner you'll only have a fight making things worse.

After your SWH. I urge you to stop trying to assign motive to what she does. I suggest that much of your feelings are there because you think she's doing things for a purpose. That purpose may or may not be true but blaming her based on your guess is not helpful to you or anyone else.

And.....if her reasons for acting that way are what you think, then she's learned to be this way over time. She's unlikely to recognize her motives. This is her adaptation to life just as your assigning motive and trying to figure things out is your way of adapting to your life. She will not change. You cannot make her change by having a talk with her. Such a talk will most likely build up more resentment on both of your parts.

It is, however, fair to talk with her brother. This situation is affecting your relationship with him Focus on the relationship over which you do have some control. Again, don't decide before hand what he thinks and feels. Put aside all those trying to figure things out thoughts and be open to hearing what he has to say. Focus on how to make this relationship work. Don't try to change him. Try to understand him. Work on finding a solution that works for both of you.

So, do you now live in the same state as your fiance and his sister do, or is this still a visit?

How old are all of these people?

I have no plans to live the life of a soap opera.

Whenever someone plays match maker they tend to try to stay in the middle of the relationship. She will too.

He knows how his sister is and he told you how she is. He is able to shrug it off but does not realize that you are about to explode. She and he have a lifetime of family affairs that you are the newbie too. Nothing is going to change her except her. She has to grow up. 25 is still very very young and I find at 25 is when most people feel like they know it all. I did - LOL

Really the best thing to do is grin and bear it in her presence then have a purge session at home with your DF. First tell him how you feel then you can both vent to each other on how annoying she can be. :)

Please know that in-law problems usually only get worse with time. Chances are your soon to be hubby will feel put in the middle and you will resent him. His family will think you are pulling him away and as the years go on the tension grow. Before you know it you guys are spending holidays separately. My aunt and uncle have been married 54 years and this issue has gotten nothing but worse for them. My aunt feels as if her husband never stuck up for her and my uncle feels she was unreasonable and forced him to choose. It is so sad to see how much this dynamic ruined so many things in their lives. My uncle is now has very ill and unable to take care of himself and my aunt is forcing herself to help him even though she feels he was not there for her. Yikes! Please get some help with this and don't say your vows until this is sorted, if it can be.

Just be polite to her and don't let her bother you. Rise above it all. It's silly really. If she is being a pain to her brother let him deal with it. Ignore her digs. Be polite but keep your distance. Be happy she does not live near you! She will be your SIL for life so try to have a good relationship with her....or at least make attempts now and then to improve your relationship. But if she truly drives you nuts then be polite but disengaged. Don't let her bother you.