Now I Know Why They Call It the Terrible Two's

Time out, as in sitting on the steps or in a corner, never worked for our son either. He had some awful tantrums when he was 4. What worked for us was to lock him in his room. The previous owners of our house had turned the doorknobs around on the kids' bedrooms, so they locked from the outside. I know it sounds awful, but he was safe and he couldn't leave, he couldn't follow me around screaming, I didn't have to hold him down in his time-out place (counterproductive!) and it removed him from the situation. I would set a timer to start his 4 minutes (his age!) as soon as he was quiet. Usually, he was asleep by the time it went off, but that was okay, we both needed the break.
Fight and win these battles now while your child is smaller than you. Children need to know there are adults in charge; it makes them feel safe. Be very careful to choose only battles that are important.
It's easier to avoid a tantrum than it is to punish for one. Ward them off when you can. Here are my basic tantrum-avoiding rules:
-Give warnings that it is almost time to leave, or go to bed, or turn off the TV.
-Repeat what your child is saying so they know you understand what it is they want. Explain why they can't have it right now.
-Ask for help in little ways when you are doing chores.
-Let your child know ahead of time what you is expected, and what will happen if the rules aren't followed.
-Offer choices whenever you can, even if they seem unimportant to you. (Do you want to make your bed before or after breakfast? Do you want to put away the blocks or the train first? Do you want apples or carrots for your snack? Which shoe do you want to put on first?)It will give a sense of control over the world, which is what a lot of tantrums are about.
-Recognize good behavior and reward it with your attention. Read an extra story at night if it's been a good day.
Our son is 20 now, and gave us some clashes of will as a teenager too. Although we had some tough times, these stubborn streaks turned out to be the hallmark of a very persistent, independent young man.

Hang in there, and good luck!

Short answer: The time-out chair isn't being used effectively.

No you're not expecting too much, but it might also be in the way it's being handled. There was a 2-3 year old I babysat, and she didn't want to pick up her toys either because it overwhelmed her. BUT if I stayed in there and said, "okay - where's that toy go? and where's that other toy go?" until they were all put away, there wasn't a battle, and she'd put all the toys away.

And with the whole Time-Out issue - I've seen a LOT of cases where it took the parent(s) 2-3 hours of consistantly putting the child back into the time out spot before the child finally gave in and stayed there. It took 2-3 hours because the parent(s) wasn't/weren't consistant about putting them there, and making sure they stayed there.

SuperNanny says to put them in the time-out spot, tell them, "I'm putting you in time out because..." and fill in the blank. It's 1 minute per year of age. Every time the child gets up, put him/her back in the spot. Don't say anything, just do it until they finally stay there. (And every time the process isn't done right, the next time out will keep getting harder to do because the child won't think you're serious.) Once the child finally stays in time-out for the appropriate time, go talk to her and say, "I put you in time out because....you didn't put your toys away (for example). I want an apology (then give a kiss and a hug) and now we'll go take care of your toys, okay?"

For what it's worth...and good luck!

I use to have to hold my child in time out. I would hold him for 2 minutes (their age) and then allow him to recover on his own. It took a few weeks with keeping to the same rules and punishment and he learned what he could and couldn't do.
Keep it simple when you start. If she is not allowed to do it today, she is not allowed to do it tomorrow or next week. Pick things she has to do or not do and stick to it.
Keep No for serious offenses. If I say no, my son knows to stop in his tracks because there may be danger.
I don't know how true it is, I once heard that young children don't hear "don't". So when you say "don't jump on the bed" they hear "jump on the bed". So, try to keep it positive.
As for picking up the toys, try it together. I don't think she should be picking them up on her own. We STILL do everything together and my son will be 6 next month. He can clean up his toys in his room, while I make his bed. I go back and put them where they really go while he's at school. He carries the laundry to the laundry room, while I load the washer. If I am not within eyesight he simply gets distracted and cant get the task complete (the way I need it done). So, maybe she can put the doll away, while you clean up the blocks.

I know how challenging a two year old can be. However, I have found that punishment and reward are not the best options for teaching appropriate behavior. Time outs especially don't teach anything. As for the example you mentioned, telling a 2 year old to clean up her toys is a vague request and probably overwhelmed her. She didn't know where to start so she acted out a little as a way to tell you that. For her age, I would say something like "Here, put your blocks in the box while I pick up your stuffed animals" or if it's just one toy then show her how you want it put away. Her tasks need to be broken down into one simple step. She's probably a little young for 2 step problems.
And as for overall discipline, I would highly highly highly recommend Kvols's "Redirecting Children's Behavior". It'll give you a new perspective on what discipline means for a child and it'll show you how to teach them appropriate behavior. I had so much trouble when my oldest was 2. Like your daughter, she was generally well-behaved but when occasions for discipline did arise they turned into horrible experiences for both of us. But I read that book and completely changed my approach to her and it's been smooth sailing and she's much more well-mannered than most 3 year olds. Good luck!

When I was watching my youngest grandson I always was firm with his time outs and taking toys away. I told him this granny would not put up with bad behavor and if he stayed bad no more george and he would settle down. As to picking up toys she certainly is at the right age to learn. In the begining I told him you pick up one and I will pick up one. He would race me to see who got done first. My health as turned from bad to terrible and Momma felt daycare would be best for him. The teacher there is suprized how smart he is and that he's already done much of what they will do this year. They also were suprised he picks up the toys because the other children do not. I had him proficant in his letters, numbers, he was begining to read and do Math. He know's about 50 or so sight words. I miss him greatly buy with my vision goining and so many dr appointments it was fro the best. I had him for a year and he didn't even seak wuhen I first got him. I still cry evry day for him.

We have been working on picking up with our 24 month old, and the only thing that seems to work for him is to make a big game out of it. Instead of saying 'can you please pick that up' I'll say 'oooh, I'm gonna pick it up and put it away first' or 'can you be a big helper and put this in the bin super-fast?' for some reason we always have to include speed in the request, I guess that's what REALLY gets him going?
Don't know if this will help you at all, but thought I'd let you know what was currently working for me :)
Good luck
~J.

I believe in choosing your battles. I am not exactly sure when children are able to pick up their toys effectively. I have a 12, 13 and 16 year old and they still tend not to pick up after themselves. I think it is important to have order but I don't think you can expect too much from a 2 year old. We use to do the clean up song. Set the timer and you help her pick up for a brief period of time while singing. You know, "Time for the 5 minute clean up" After that praise her on what a great job and how much nicer her room looks or whatever the chore was. I reserved time outs and discipline for serious things. Think carefully before a discipline and make sure you are willing to go through with it or don't bother in the first place. I think inconsistincy with discipline is really confusing for a child and they only learn not to believe you. What is their incentive to listen to you when they know there is a good chance there will be no consequences. Be firm and calm and kneel down to her level and look her in the eye and be clear about why she is getting a time out and for how long. All that being said there were many times when I felt like ripping my hair out and ended up screaming like a two year old my self, which made everyone feel bad. Always remember, this too shall pass. L. R

No, not too much to ask for but, you will have to make it seem fun and help her. It is too much for a two year old to grasp. If you were put in a hoarders home and asked to pick up by yourself, you would feel like a two year old being asked to pick up their toys. It is time for her to start. It really has to be a joint effort. The tantrums come from frustration on her part. The first thing you have to work on is hitting and biting. It is not okay and has to stop. The correct tone of voice is used correctly should tell her you mean it. It is working with my two year old and with my other three kids. Good Luck. C.

No, you are NOT asking too much. Abbie was picking up her toys at two. HOWEVER, at two, it was a group or her & dad or her & I. Make a counting game out of it. Who can pick up the most? If you pick up one, have her pick up one and count one, etc....making it a combined & shared effort. If they know WHERE to get toys out, they know WHERE to put them back!

As far as timeout goes, you HAVE to be consistent and it needs to be someplace other than her room where she can play if she goes there. It may be a lot more effort for a short while, but in the long run you'll THANK GOD you made the effort. No more......or very few battles. Regardless, you HAVE to have consequences and you MUST be consistent. Might want to watch NANNY 911 or one of those shows. This is a pretty common problem but it CAN be overcome! DON'T WAIT any longer!

No, it's not too much too ask her to clean up toys. But, you can't expect her to do it all by herself, still a bit young for that. Make it a game that you or dad help her, she picks up and you put in toy box or other way around, sing a song while helping her clean, etc. Time outs, no don't do in her room if she has toys in there, totally counter productive. Find a time out spot and if you have to put her in it 50 times, you've got to do it. Get a timer that she can see, set it and tell her not to get up, if she does put her back and keep doing so. She's got to see you mean business. If you do this for a week or so, maybe not even that long she will get it. Kids live for structure, consistency, and discipline and if they don't have those boundaries they are going to run around like crazy kids because they don't know what to do with themselves. Goodluck

Hi J.,
My daughter is 32 months old, so I know what you are going through. When she was 18 months old (and not difficult, lol) her pediatrician recommended the book 1-2-3 Magic. It teaches the concept of time-out with some really good information. I'm sure you can find it at your library. In the book, it says that putting a toddler in time-out is more an opportunity for them to calm down or stop a behavior and less a form of punishment. So if your child is playing in her room during time-out, then that's okay. Now, if you really don't want her to play, then I would take her toys out of her room permanently (not just during the time-out). That way, when you send her to her room, the toys just aren't there and you don't have to go in there and take them away. I have had a lof of success with the methods from the book, but you have to be consistent and follow the method exactly. And give it some time - it won't work overnight, but if you stick to it, eventually you'll find that you're doing a lot less yelling and the tantrums are decreasing.

As for cleaning up her toys, I don't think she's too young, but I think it would be better if you had her help you instead of her doing it by herself. And give LOTS of warnings and transition time. About 10 min before, get down to her level, look her in the eye and say "Okay, in a few minutes, you and I are going to pick up all your legos!" And then repeat the warning every few minutes. When the 10 minutes has passed, say "Okay, it's time to clean up. Please come help me pick up your legos." If she helps without a fight, make sure you give TONS of praise and thank yous. That is how you reward the behavior. And then brag on her to her daddy or anyone else that is around. I have found that transition time and warnings are integral to getting my daughter to cooperate. If I spring something on her without a warning, she is more likely to ignore me or fight about it.

I am sorry your daughter is frustrating you. The thing I always remind my husband is that toddlers behave the worst with the people they trust the most. They need structure and consistency. They need to know there are consequences. It helps guide their behavior. I wish you a TON of luck.

All my best!
A.

Hi, J.! It's hard, I know! I had two boys at 15 months apart, and I thought I wouldn't make it through! They are 10-1/2 and almost 12, and they turned out just fine! First and foremost, be consistent! That's the key! Then she will know what to expect from you. At 2-1/2, she should most certainly be able to help pick up her toys. I wouldn't use her bedroom as a time-out place though. Like you mentioned, there are too many things to do in there. I used to put my boys in a chair in the dining room where they couldn't see the TV or anything else going on around the first floor. They hated it! But it worked! They wouldn't sit there either, but there were times that I had to almost sit on them (not really), to get them to stay in the chair. If they started acting up, the timer started over again. When they realized that I wasn't joking, they sat there and sat quietly. If they got up, the timer started over. After a while, we used the corner, that was even better for us. They hated it, but it was the most effective thing. They had to stand there with hands at their sides and were not allowed to look around... their nose was in the corner. They hated it, but they knew what to expect, because that's what we always did. Maintain your patience as best you can, because it's a tough time! But the key is to be consistent. Try not to raise your voice either, because then she will think it's okay to yell at people. Just use a first voice and give her "the eye"! You may also want to take something away from her, like now allowing her to watch one of her shows that day, because she wouldn't listen. I wouldn't take every show away for the day, but just one short one, just to let her know that you mean business. Best of luck!

First of all, organize her toys and put them in containers she cannot get into easily or lock them in her closet- or switch closets in the house so the toys are not at her disposal all the time.
Yes, she is old enough to pick up. My daughter's son is 2 and a half and he picks up his toys-but it was not easy at first. Tell her she must pick up one thing before getting other things out.
Also, for time out, let her know that her time out is 10 minutes or 15 minutes, and set your kitchen timer. Sit her close to where you are working so you can catch her if she gets up. Or, use a baby gate to keep her in her room.
When the time is up, tell her "now pick up the toys or I'm setting the timer again".
Biting and hitting you should never be tolerated. Pick her up and put her in her bed if she does this. A baby bed is great if she can't climb out or play pen kept near you so you can make sure she can't get out.
Discipline takes patience. A child her age that is out of hand will listen better if you swat her bottom and then tell her what you want her to know. This gets her attention and is not meant as punishment.
After several days of doing the above, she will be listening better.

She is definitely old enough to clean up on her own! You are not expecting too much. However, if you're just starting the process, it will take her awhile to get used to it. Maybe start with her helping you pick up. You can pick up a toy or two and make a big deal about how fun it is, then hopefully she'll join in! If she throws a fit, let her. Put her down in the middle of the room and let her cry and scream. Just make sure there's nothing she can hurt herself with. She's probably doing it for attention. Don't pick her up, don't make eye contact, just go about your business. When she's done with her fit, make her clean up.

Time outs--Don't use her bedroom. I would try the naughty chair again. Use the SuperNanny technique. Just keep putting her back until she sits for 2 or three minutes. It will be exhausting! She will get up over and over and over again, but you have to stick to your guns. If you let her out without following through on the punishment, she's not going to take you seriously. It will take time and lots and lots of patience! You can do it though!

When I worked for head start preschool we had many issues with children not staying in the time out chairs so we were instructed to sit in the chair and hold the child on our laps.The longer they fought it the longer we sat.When their time was up we told them again why they were put in time out and if they stopped the bad behavior they would not end up there again.
secondly you are not expecting to much of her by requesting her to pick up her toys.She got them out she can put them away.This teaches responsibility and common curtisy to you and others.If she refuses and has a fit put her in time out for disobeying you then when her time is up make her do the chore.Yes it would be easier to do yourself but that only teaches her to treat you like a maid.
Good Luck

J.,

You need to be consistent and for her to know that this behavior is unacceptable. This advise was passed down to me. My three year old in a time out would start screaming and stopping her feet. Someone had told me about putting a drop or two of vinegar on her lips, tongue....I did it and it really helped. Everytime she got to the stage, I will say, do you want vinegar and then she says no. I put her in front of me and make eye contact and I tell explain to her what she is doing is unacceptable and that is not allowed. Then she will go in her time out. I also don't count it until she is quite. That helped me out tremendously......

With my 3-year old daughter, I will tell her that I am going to take a toy away if she doesn't do what I say after I count to three. I will count slowly. And if I get to three, I will take her toy away. I will put it in a place out of her reach, but she can still see it. That is a true punishment. At least it works for my daughter. Every child is different. You do have to be consistent with your punishments though. And she should start puting her toys away. Of course, try to make it fun. My daughter wouldn't put her toys away at that age. I would help her and would end up doing most of the work. Just recently she started cleaning (so it could be an age thing too). I think if you help her clean up every day, then she will get in the habit eventually. Good luck!

Sounds to me like you have done away with the high chair. If you still have it, great time out place. At two I found I had to make a game out of picking up the toys and we had a contest to see who picked up the most and put them away. The winner got a special treat. Reward system!!! As for screaming at you, time out and until she has quite for a least a minute then a calm voice "You do not yell at mommy or other adults" talk of about 30 seconds. The hitting is a big "no". Tell her calmly to stop, if she tries again she is warned you will hit her if she does it again, and if she does it again then pick her up, put her across your knee and pop her on the butt two times and she gets to go to time out. Biting is just not happening, same procedure as hitting but unfortunately you do have to bite her back.
Consistancy is the key to training her, unfortunately and you have to make the effort and take the time to be consistant.
I will pray for you.

When my kids were that age, they stood in the corner. Every single time they started throwing a fit, I immediately told them to stand in the corner. The first time I did it, I stood behind them and made sure they never turned around. They literally had to stand with thei noses pretty much in the corner. If they turned around, or stepped away from the corner, I would say, "put your nose in the corner" and if they didn't, I'd walk over and say "like this" and move them closer to the corner. I kept doing this until they stayed there until their time out was over. To me, this is way more effective than sitting in a time out chair because they can still sit there and keep themselves busy by looking around at stuff. If they're in the corner, they're concentrating on staying in place. There's no squirming or leaning to see what's going on in the other room when you're standing with your nose in the corner. It worked great for me. Your daughter should totally be picking up toys at this point. As a matter of fact, I started having my kids help me make their beds when they turned 3, and by the time they were 4, they were making them every morning on their own. There are lots of reasons for a child needing to go to a corner. Once they learn that all bad behaviors will get them put into the boring corner, trust me, she'll lighten up and start listening.