I'm Sorry, But... - Washington,DC

Well, whenever I have a conflict started by someone else, its always nice to hear the explanation, no matter how the explanation is started or worded. So I guess I would appreciate the explanation and the opportunity to talk about it and work something out, instead of being ignored and they pretend they did nothing wrong.

I HATE "I'm sorry, but..."

People need to learn to say what they mean (word nazi here).

The phrase they're looking for is EITHER

I really regret ______

Or

I don't give a darn but want you to not be angry with ME, while I get to still be angry with you.

Sounds like next time the Ipad will stay home where it belongs. Think both have (hopefully) learned a lesson here about listening.

LOL It serves her right!!!
My response might have been "I'm sorry but you asked for it and it serves you right!!!

Half @zz apology and I'd let it go now, but in the moment I might have said something.
Were your kids in the wrong, sure. They probably should have known better but GRANDMA REALLY should have known better for SURE.

Maybe now she'll listen and respect what you have to say and your limits.

"But what Mom? I told you I didn't want the iPad in the house but you gave it back to the kids anyway. THEN you get mad because they ordered stuff after you said it was okay. What did you expect? How about you just apologize for your actions without trying to justify or rationalize them? And how about you listen to me next time when I say no to something?"

I know you don't want to drag it out, but that's what I would be saying...

Oh my heck, I HATE those apologies!

Hubby does it to me all the time! GRR!

It's NOT an apology... An apology is when you recognize that what you did or how you acted was wrong... IF you say, "I'm sorry, but...." then it means that you are validating that you thought you had the right to do something/act in that way, and that you are NOT actually sorry for the action...

I always hear "I'm sorry you don't like my behavior, but I still think I was right." ... which means it will probably happen again.
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Now, I WILL accept it if it's meant as an explanation of their behavior... but not as an actual apology.

So... Say hubby doesn't do something he promised to do, because he decided to watch TV instead... When I hear that apology, it should be "I'm sorry I didn't get it done, I'll go do it now..." End of story.

BUT say he didn't do it because DD was being a real handful... Then, "I'm sorry, but DD was being a pill," is perfectly acceptable.

Focusing on the question here and not your mother's AND your children's complete disregard for you:

Do I accept these apologies? Well, they are not apologies. Having run 1000+ social skills groups during my tenure as a school psychologist, I will argue that this is NOT an apology. It is a request for you to dismiss her bad behavior.

My husband attempts this occassionally and I will literally talk him through a "proper" apology. Does it make him feel like a child? Probably, but after 10 years together he should know that a real apology consists of:
1. Eye contact or a non-distracted phone call. Emails do not count. They are passive aggressive.
2. Statement of what you are sorry for doing with no "qualifying statements". In this case it SHOULD have been "Daughter, I am sorry that I undid your parenting and then lost my cool with you".
3. Some kind of promise to avoid doing it again. "Next time you ask me not to do something, I will respect that request".

Hopefully she learned a few things here, but not likely. When I was working with adolescent boys with Asperger's we had to talk through this and practice it all the time for many reasons, the primary one being that they had never experienced/observed/heard a real apology before and had nothing to model!

I think the missing word would have been "and"...

"I'm sorry and I'll check with you next time about allowing the kids internet access without your permission."

Would've worked a world of wonders, probably. I also wouldn't have offered to compensate mom for her mistake. If we rescue people from their mistakes, we keep them from feeling the full effects of it. This is why banks don't compensate people who give out their debit cards or PINs to those not on their account. Maybe the kids need to work out a payment arrangement with Grandma for the overage and put their allowance toward paying that back?

The 9 and 7 year old are at the point they can understand what YOU say goes. NOONE outranks you! They are also old enough to understand your expectation of their behavior doesn't budge no matter what someone else does, including an adult.

As for your mother? She's lucky it was you, I'd be doing my I told you so for an obnoxious amount of time! Maybe this will be a lesson to her as well? You need to let her know this was HER doing because she tried to circumvent your authority over your kids. Tell her you expect her to support your decisions in the future. I would take her apology with a grain of salt and would use it as a learning and reminder for future situations.

Ugh. Cruddy.
She was trying to be nice...but give kids an inch and they'll take a mile, right?

She should realize that it is a dangerous situation to have an open, credit-card linked App store account. They should have to enter a password and redeem a gift card (which she can provide and when it's gone--it's gone!).

She went over your head and gave it to them when you asked her not to.
So...in my book...she is at fault and she gets the consequences.
AND you offered to pay.

So...take the apology, but come to a resolution about the account. Apple may not be so quick to refund next time.

(And for the record, the words "I'm sorry" followed by a "but" are false apologies.)

i definitely think your mom was way out of line, and in general, apologies that start out "i'm sorry BUT" are not true apologies. so yes, i'd be TICKED.

i would be less ticked at the kids - she totally had them confused and SHE was trying to "give them permission" to disobey you. that's their grandma, and an adult. of course they'd be confused. don't be too hard on them. just make sure they know that you HAVE to give the okay - grandma or grandpa or whoever, can't override mom. they have to at least ask you first before doing something you have said no to. but don't be too hard on them.

GOOD LUCK. i'd be SO mad at your mom. that was deliberate and sneaky.

PS, i absolutely would NOT have offered her a dime. again, she was deliberate and went behind your back. you don't get my hard earned money for that!

As soon as you add "but," it's not an apology.

The 'I'm sorry but' apologies indicate that the person giving the apology really doesn't feel like 1. they should be apologizing at all 2. doesn't feel like it was 100% his/her fault or 3. They're tired of the situation and just want to move on.

Sometimes I give/accept these kind of apologies when I'm just done with the whole thing. They don't necessarily indicate that the matter has been resolved, obviously.

Grandma should have known better than to overstep her bounds, which is what she did when you said 'no thanks' and she gave your kids the iPad AGAIN.

Well, if they ran up her bill, then she learned something, didn't she? I would calmly tell her that this is why you didn't want them to have it. They are too young for the responsibility. It seems to me that she wants to still be right if she adds the "but..." onto it. If you want to drop it you can either ignore it or say, "Next time please listen to me about my children and save us all a lot of hassle and hard feelings."

There's accept as in know in your heart they are sorry and accept as in "I won't say any more about it, but that was really half-hearted."

oooh Rachel!! this isn't about being "sorry"..

Your mother willfully disrespected you and your "NO" - your boundaries.
Your children, however great they are!!, willfully disobeyed you and they went into your room to retrieve something you told them they could NOT have!!!

Your mom had no right to lose her cool. This might be a learning lesson for her - when you say NO to something she should listen...

She told the kids to order. They did. I don't have an iPad so I don't know if it actually shows the much the order total is for a given day or period.

Your kids? I would expect better from them. I know you run a tight ship and treat your children fairly and with respect. Them going into your room shows a HUGE breach in my eyes...

So to answer your question? Would I accept my mother's apology? Yes. Would I "forget" the incident? No. Would I remind her in the future about checking with me PRIOR to giving my children electronics? yes.

I'm glad she got her money back. But really - the charges were the consequences of her OWN actions.....

The only way to get through this is to try to find the humor in it. I find that laughing about things my mom does that normally piss me off helps our relationship a lot. And she can be pretty obstinate and annoying.

An apology ends at, "I'm sorry for _____." Adding "but ..." cancels out the apology.

I'm in the process of teaching the skills of an appropriate apology to my children.

She should have kept her apology to, "I'm sorry I didn't honor your request about the iPad. I'm also sorry I lost my temper with you/the children." If she wanted to continue the discussion, she could then have added, "Now I'd like to discuss a solution to keep this from happening again."

You also went above and beyond by offering to cover whatever she wouldn't be reimbursed for and what she didn't want to pay for. I wouldn't have done that because the whole thing started because she didn't honor your parenting request. Lesson learned for Grandma.

I'm a bit confused as to why the children need to have consequences. Is it because they knew they were in cahoots with Grandma behind your back? If that's the case, I would go with something like having them spend some of their allowance money on some of their favorite lunch and snack foods and then bringing them to the food bank to have the boys donate the stuff to the town food pantry.

I would also reinforce the rule about "even if Grandma says it's all right, disobeying Mom and going behind Mom's back to do it isn't all right."

Oh wow! I would be upset with the whole situation, yes. I'd say your mom had the big bill coming (who tells young children they can go online shopping "if they keep it under a certain amount?" I haven't met a child yet with decent budgeting skills at that age!). I think for subverting you, your mom gets what she gets.

And then the kids... wow, they would have some big punishment coming. They knew they weren't allowed, so they waited until the sitter was there, then they went over the dollar amount grandma had specified anyway... they disobeyed every adult in this case, and I'm sure you will have plenty of punishment heading their way for the whole situation!

Yeah, I'd need a few Excedrin after the day you've had so far! :-P

No, I do not. The very nature of the word BUT tells you that the two things on either side are in contradiction with each other.

I've had to distance myself from particular people who would say, "I'm sorry, but you're not perfect, either."

Hi, Mom:

G. Mom has to learn just like your children, you are the authority figure.
Boy, is that hard to teach and for others to learn.

A Family group decision making conference (FGDM) is in order.

Gather everyone in a circle: hubby, children, g. mom and other interested people.

Go around in a circle and ask each one these questions:
1. What happened?
2. What were you thinking of at the time?
3. What ave you thought about since?
4. Who has been affected by what you have done? In what way?
5. What do you think you need to do to make things right?

Ask those who were not party to the action these questions, you will respond after others have spoken.

1. What did you think when you realized what had happened?
2. What impact has this incident had on you and others?
3. What has been the hardest thing for you?
4. What do you think needs to happen to make things right?

Make the agreement.

There is a way to make a formal apology.

Good luck.
D.

Resource: www.iirp.edu

my 2 cents, in this situation, because you have freely admitted that they kdis should have listened, and not taken something out of your room that you had more or less Put away from them. in this situation, I would accept the half apology,
to put it another way, if she had given it to them and you had accepted it and then she had freaked out, then No I wouldn't have accepted that sort of an apology because then it would all be on grandma for freaking.
instead of being a bit on her for freaking and a bit on them for sneaking.

But since it seems as if she has a history of half apologies i might be extra mad too.

it sounds like she is very frustrating to deal with but that you aren't at the point of cutting her off completely. If you want to make an issue of it, focus on her dismissing your wishes in the first place instead of the apology.

Your mother is apologizing for losing her cool, and then adds "but" - so she's justifying her overall actions.

I note she is NOT apologizing for going behind your back and doing something you specifically did not want done. THAT'S what the apology should be for, with a promise not to undermine you again. She has no reason to be pissed - she gave an internet-enabled piece of hardware to 3 children 9 and under. So now she's pissed and somehow it's YOUR problem that they went and used it? No children should be making purchases like that. You know it but she doesn't.

Her best bet - or yours - is to sell the iPad and put the money toward her bill. I realize she got her money back, but still. Then find a better hiding place for the iPad (giving it back to her means she'll let the kids use it when you aren't looking). (By the way, a girl in my family hid her diary in the last place her sister would look - under her sister's mattress!)

If your mother has done this sort of thing before, she's an ongoing problem. She wants to be the POPULAR grandma but undermining the mean, strict parents? Oh no, that's not gonna fly.

I would not listen to her excuses because those aren't really an apology. An apology involves a recognition of wrongdoing and some sort of assurance that it will never happen again. So far, I don't read anything in your post that implies that your mother has any clue that what she did was wrong. It sounds like she's mad at YOU for your "ill-mannered kids" - which is blaming it on you and absolving herself of any real responsibility!

So in that sense, I wouldn't accept the apology because it's not for what you're upset about. You can try to explain it to your mother, or you can limit her interaction with your kids.

Yes, they should have consequences for disobeying you, but they have the added confusion of another adult they love giving them complete permission to go behind your back. I can see that it was confusing to them. I'm not excusing them completely, but I think your bigger problem is your mother.

Good luck with this.

Did you see Cheryl O's post on a similar subject?

http://www.mamapedia.com/questions/1296867224665128961

:)

Your kids should have known better.

Worry about them. You can't control how an adult behaves, but you can teach your children respect. They were incredibly disrespectful, worry about that.

Would I accept it, yes. Under these circumstances, yes. If there was no reason for her to be angry, then no. She had a reason. There are not many circumstances, in which that kind of apology is a good enough one. In this situation, your kids ran up her bill. What did you expect? Rainbows and unicorns?

ETA: If you meant PER purchase, say that in the ORIGINAL question. I can only go off what YOU tell me. And, really? You REALLY think your kids though they were doing the right thing? The 9 year old especially, had to have known better. They went into your room AFTER you put it up and said NO multiple times. That is THEIR fault. THEY disobeyed, big time. That infraction has zero to do with your mother.